St. Pat's organizer: What more can we do?

St. Patrick's Day Parade organizer Mary Nestel isn't happy with front-page news like this:

• Shots were fired, and a family was brutally attacked by youths in a parking lot near 16th Street and Grand Boulevard.Police broke up at least 10 fights, tackled a gunman and nearly shot a juvenile who had a toy gun.
• In one attack Friday, a Kansas City Star employee and his family were kicked and beaten toward the end of the parade in one of the newspaper’s parking lots. A witness and Star security officials said one youth shot a gun into the air.
• Star story Saturday: Violence returns with gunfire, beatings, arrests

I called Mary this morning to see what, if anything, might be done differently next year.

"What more can we do?" she said. "We can’t tell certain people not to come down. It’s Kansas City’s largest single-day event, so aside from charging people to come...

"Where are our leaders in Kansas City to start looking at these, as the police called it, young thugs? Because the police did their jobs. They were all out there. We did not cut back in staffing. We even bought more barricades.

"We did our job by putting on an unbelievably successful parade. You could tell that by the thousands of people who came down and had a great time. And then a small 1 percent had to have a bad time thanks to some young thugs. Why were they even there?"

She told me she still hasn't seen a police report, and expects to meet with police later this week. She didn't like The Star placing the arrests story next to the parade recap on the front page Saturday:

"What are you guys going to do when that Arena opens and there’s a huge concert and everyone comes outside and about two blocks of cars are broken into and 10 people get mugged?" she said. "Are you going to put that right next to it? How is it going to be successful? It's not."

Update: Thursday, March 23, 2006:
I thought it would be helpful to put meeting updates, TV/radio links on the topic, etc. here.

Tonight: KCPT's Ruckus, 7-7:30 p.m., will discuss the parade, among other topics.

On Friday, the public television station's Week in Review program will also have the parade as a topic at 7:30 p.m.

On Monday, Kansas City police will conduct an internal review of their deployment and performance at the parade. Spokesman Capt. Rich Lockhart has also responded on this blog to a critic.

A report on the parade requested by Mayor Kay Barnes will be presented to the Kansas City Police Board at 9 a.m. Tuesday.

The Kansas City St. Patrick's Day Parade Committee will hold its wrap-up meeting Wednesday.

I'd be glad to add/link to other meetings, events or shows.

Comments

[Uncle Jay]

I've noticed today that in your Community Faces section under Local News you have 200 photos from the parade yet I don't see 1 "thug." By The Stars' reporting I was expecting to see chaos and mayhem, people with terror frozen in their faces from the onslaught of lawlessness. It seems like it would be easy to get those pictures since your reporting made it sound widespread. Heck, the beating happen in your parking lot - your photographer could have probably taken that picture from your building.

Or maybe 99% of everyone there had a great time watching a parade that was well organized.

Do you report Chiefs' games the same way as the parade - "The Marring of the Red" - when there are assaults and arrests at a Chiefs game. No, you don't - you say Chiefs Win or Chiefs Lose. Is a Chiefs' game a family atmosphere, absolutely not.

You're not just reporting on the parade, you are slanting the view.

[Amie Donaldson]

My husbands family has for years enjoyed the St Patricks day parade. But this year it was bad. We took our 1 year old son to see the parade and within 1 hour smelled pot and was at the very spot were the arrest was made with the kid and the gun. And not just any hand gun this was a gun that I have only seen on T.V. I immediately left and we will not be going back to the St Paticks day parade. And I DO have pictures of the the take down and the gun.

[Adam]

I was directly in front of this white Star employee being attacked by a group of black thugs. I saw the Star employee being kicked and punched by a group of blacks. Police were on the scene within minutes after someone fired what sounded like a 22 caliber pistol in the air. The crowd that was cheering the black thugs on disbursed.

When the attack started there were bands of black school aged youths watching the parade. Once the attack broke out I heard several say, “A fight, A fight” and then they went rushing over, jumping up and down cheering on their fellow thugs who were beating up a white family. Once the shot was fired in the air and everyone went running away from the attack, several of these youths were talking about how the “brotha’s” beat some white folk and then making fun of how the people who were attacked were cowards.

What is wrong with the black community and ITS leaders??? I am not African-American because I do not hold a dual citizen ship thus I do not need a hyphenated label. I am however a product of the black community but I am an American first. One that is concerned about what blacks are teaching blacks.

[John F. Knipper]

My wife, daughter and myself made our way to the 16th and Grand area to watch this years parade. This was my wife's first parade, being from Georgia and only being in KC for 4 years. This area was full of drinking and the smell of pot. The majority of the crowd was young African Americans. We enjoyed the parade, feeling somewhat secure as we saw groups of police officers in the area every 10-15minutes. The crowd started getting rowdy so about 30-45 minutes before the end we decided to leave. We had parked about 4-6 blocks away and had to make our way through the KC Star parking lot. It was then that I did not feel safe, as we passed groups of "thug" dressed and unruly acting youths. The 3 of us held hands and talked about the draw to this "look" or lifestyle and how violent it appears even on the outside. We made it safely to our car. The next morning I read that an attack on a white family (we are white), occured within less than a block from where we walked through only 30 min's or so later. It could have been us, unbelievable. We will probably not attend the parade again, unless we stay closer to Crown Center or maybe the west side of the street closer to the Washington Park area. I never realized how scary a city Kansas City looked like until this parade. The vendors openly selling pot leaves on everything to necklaces and hats to sunglasses. Unbelievable! A family friendly event? We really have a problem in this city and it starts with our black community. I would say 60% or more of the young African American men at the parade were dressed like the thugs that are idolized on MTV, etc. This was a an eye opening experience and my heart hurts for this community.

[Uncle Jay]

I'm not saying there were no problems. There were, but there are problems anywhere when you get over 100,000 people together. I certainly wish nothing like this would happen, but it will whether at a parade or in a parking lot or in a driveway or at the mall. Adam's post points out the bigger problems.

[Uncle Jay]

For those that say they will not come back to the parade, is it just the parade? Is it anything Downtown? Is it anything in KCMO?

The parade can't solve racial tension or pot smoking.

[Amie D]

My family will not be attending ANY downtown events in KCMO. Which is very unfortunate.

[Andrea]

I just want to say the woman in the "young Thugs" article is completely right with her comment to the downtown arena and the area period!! It's only gonna get worse, and an arena is NOT going to make downtown any better and attract new people/business.

[David]

To John F. Knipper,

Its really quite embarrassing to know that I live in a city with someone who is open and blatantly racist. The problem does not necessarily lie with the young black community in Kansas City. Yes, I can admit that some of the fault lies there but it is nowhere near their complete fault. The problem is with the stories and reports that are embellished by attendees such as yourself and are subsequently sucked up by the media in order to provide some sort of sensationalism to the daily news. I was born and raised in the Johnson County area, (and I am white) and have listened to the cries of "affluent" communities such as Leawood and Blue Valley for years; proclaiming that downtown Kansas City and its immediate surroundings are some sort of demilitarized zone that should be avoided at all costs. Yes, I do see the dozens of reports each week in the news discussing the numerous shootings, beatings, robberies, etc that occur in the downtown area. While I do believe these problems exist, I think that the media has placed a certain spin on things in order to make us believe that downtown is a cesspool in need of dire cleaning. Kansas City suffers the same problems as any metropolitan area, and I could easily argue that downtown KC is hundreds of times safer than other areas I have had the opportunity to live in or visit. (Chicago or San Diego anyone?) Before you go pointing the finger at a single community of Kansas City, take a look around you first. If you dig deep enough, you will find that the spoiled little rich kids from Johnson County often find themselves in just as much trouble as the "thug dressed and unruly acting youths" from the black community. If I had to place a wager on the incident, I would guess that a drunk member of the "white" family didnt know how to control his mouth which lead to the escalation of the problem. But will you find that fact reported anywhere in the news? No - because we all would like to point the finger at someone else, rather than looking at ourselves. It's a sad, yet realistic fact of our society. We never want to take the blame for something, we always want to point the finger at someone else, and when asked "How can we fix it?", we reply that, "It isn't *my* job to fix it" You also stated that "This area was full of drinking and the smell of pot. The majority of the crowd was young African Americans." OK, and your point there is what? If I were to attend a concert at Verizon Ampitheatre, (let's use the rock group 311 as an EXAMPLE) this is a concert in which the general audience would be composed of mostly younger, white people. One of the first things I would notice would be that the atmosphere consisted largely of those partaking in the comsumption of both alcohol and pot. I have attended several of the above mentioned groups concerts, so I speak from personal experience. Take some responsiblity for your own actions rather than blaming someone else. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that these incidents didn't occur; but I would guess that they didn't fold out in the way that people are describing them.

[Uncle Jay]

I'm sorry to hear that Amie, but is it because you feel unsafe? My daughter was assaulted 6 or so years ago leaving a restaurant at 119th and Metcalf. I still eat at restaurants along 119th street.

Crime can happen anywhere. I pay attention to what is happening around me whether I'm at Town Center or Downtown. I really enjoy experiencing parts of this city and the threat (or perceived threat) of crime will not change that. If I want really good BBQ I'm going to Bryant'sat 18th and Brooklyn. I'm not going to never eat Bryant's again because of the area of the city it is in. Just me.

[Erin]

I just have to say I am so unbelievably sick of the St. Patrick's Day Parade getting blamed for a problem that is clearly the city's problem. Over the past three or four years, the parade committee has been regulated by the city as to what they were going to do to make it a safer parade. The Parade Committee has done everything the city has asked of them, to do their part in making it a safer event. They put up barricades, they shortened the route, they changed the time, they worked with liquor control to crack down on drinking. What more can they do? The city shouldn't be asking the parade "What are YOU going to do about this problem?" The parade should be asking the city "What are YOU going to do about this problem so we don't yank this highly attended event out of your precious Downtown and take it somewhere that can provide a safer environment". Since when is it the responsibility of an event to correct the problems a city has with a some of its inner-city youth? It wasn't a violent parade, it is a violent Downtown. It is time for the City to stand up and take responsibility!

[David]

And to end my stand on the soapbox, I will add that every single year we hear of how security has been improved to reduce the number of problems or incidents that will occur. Regardless of how much effort we put into discouraging unruly behavior, we will *ALWAYS* have someone who will complain to the media or complain to their city officials that there are problems. It will never meet every single person's expectations. To those people: If you feel that the parade or related celebrations/gatherings are not to your liking, then I suggest an alternate venue for you and your family, such as your backyard or living rooms.

[MISS THAN G]

WHY. THAT'S THE QUESTION I WANT TO ASK MY YOUNG BLACK MEN. AND YOU WONDER WHY YOU CAN'T GET IN TO CERTAIN CLUBS OR CERTAIN PEOPLE DON'T WANT YOU IN THEIR NEIGHBORHOODS. IT'S YOUR OWN STUPID ACTIONS. I WOULDN'T WANT YOU IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD EITHER. IT'S TIME TO GROW UP. IF YOU WANT TO SHOOT AND GUN AND FIGHT WITH INNOCENT PEOPLE, GO JOIN THE ARMY OR SOMETHING OF THAT NATURE. NOW YOU HAVE MESSED UP A FAMILY FUN EVENT WITH YOUR WANT TO BE THUG SELVES. YEAH I SAID WHAT TO BE CAUSE IF SOMEBODY WOULD HAVE SHOT BACK AT YOU GUYS THEN IT WOULD HAVE BEEN QUITE A DIFFERENT SCENE. I DARE ONE OF YOU TROUBLE MAKING WEED SMOKING GANG BANGIN WANNA BE'S TO GO TO CHURCH WITH ME SUNDAY AND FIGHT THE DEVIL. I CAN'T BELIEVE AN INNOCENT PERSON GOT PULLED FROM HIS VEHICLE AND BEAT-UP BY SOME STUPID UNEDUCATED (NO OFFENSE) BUT IF YOU WERE EDUCATED THEN YOU WOULD HAVE KNOW BETTER TO DO WHAT YOU DID. AS A MATTER OF FACT, I DON'T CARE IF YOU GET OFFENDED OR NOT BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO BE HARD ON ALL OF US NOT JUST THE STUPID WANNA BE'S THAT DID IT. GROW UP

[David]

Uncle Jay - I applaud you. =)

[Amie D]

I would not take my kids to a 311 concert. And kids shouldn't be at those types of concerts or events. However, the parade is suppose to be for families. I have lived in Inianapolis, and was not scared for my life going downtown by myself and walking around. I just feel bad for the people who worked so hard to make the parade a fun family event.

[ron]

go back to the day of now barricades and open drinking i say!!!! And no doubt someone bit off more than they can chew.

[ron]

go back to the day of now barricades and open drinking i say!!!! And no doubt someone bit off more than they can chew.

[Concerned Citizen]

If what happened to the white KC Star associate and his family had happened in reverse (meaning an attack on an African American family by a group of unruly young Whites), guess what would have happened? The uproar would have been defeaning. The national media would have descended upon this town with a focus placed on whites' unending racism against blacks. Why does no one ever point out that African-Americans are just as racist as whites? This was an example of African-American violence against a white family (there were children in this family who were beaten, too.) Why is this seemingly acceptable behavior in the public eye when it would not be (nor should it ever be) if it were in the reverse? What has happened to this country? Why is it ok for African-Americans to beat up on whites?

This is a shame, but what can be noted, behavior witnessed by Parade watchers can cause people (all colors) to develop images and become predjudice. This is learned predjudice, versus what some groups want to say is born predjudice. I like to think we all give everyone a chance but when stupid thugs threaten families who are trying to enjoy a community event witness fighting, shooting guns, intimidating language of course some people learn to become predjudice.

[Lisa]

I did not attend this year's St. Patrick's Day Parade. However, I have attended for numerous years in the past & the parade was always a family affair for me. I have a question to pose. What are the city officials of Kansas City and the KCPD doing to resolve this issue? I understand that they had lots of forces available, but what about the gang unit? What type of preventative efforts were in place to stop this type of mayhem? It seems clear to me that something must be done to address this group who clearly does not attend the parade to pay tribute to the Irish families & representatives along the parade route. Their intent is to show their guns & act violently. What are the Kansas City city officials & the KCPD doing to address the need for the Annual St. Patrick's Day to be some sort of gang-banger event? In addition, what is the city doing to address the racial inequalities that exist within it? When I was living in KC, St. Patrick's Day was one of the few times each year my family ventured downtown together. In fact, the only time we would venture east of Grand Street was for the parade or to attend a Royals game. What is the city doing to address the segregation that is so evident in Kansas City?

[Scott Quinn]

To Erin: I can't help but think that the Parade Committee suffers from Franklin's definition of insanity: Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. The changes you speak of are merely superficial. The constant in the equation is the location. None of the other parades around the city seems to have these problems.

[Erin]

Scott - I looks as though we seem to be making the same point. It isn't the parades fault, it is the circumstance of it's location and I would imagine the committee would start considering different locations for the future. Yes, the changes were superficial, but it was what was required by the City to "stop the violence" so the committee complied. I don't think they ever saw it as a sure fix...I think they were probably hoping that if they complied, they would get better support from the City's end.

Smoke weed, drink beer, forget the color of skin and please STFU!!

[Adam]

After I witnessed this mess on Friday afternoon I wouldn’t say that it is necessarily a color issue. It could happen to anyone of any color but it is a degrading issue that we as a society do not hold our children accountable for the things that they do. There is lack of discipline from the parents of the community in its entirety.

To solve the problems within the inner 435 corridor where the vast majority of KC’s murders occurred last year what needs to happen is self/community pride and spirit needs to be encouraged within the community. People need to quit being lazy. Get educated. These areas of blight will only return to successful areas when education is stressed. Lets find a way to make the KC school district better which in turn provides better education, better education means opportunities.

I am not speaking of hand outs or increasing education dollars but a total reform of the KC school district. The issue isn’t money in the district but accountability with the money that is spent. Education in the US is well financed. More than any other country in the world; yet our dumbed down test scores show that we are behind other industrialized nations in education.

When education is brought back to KC proper, you will see less crime, less violence, etc… Unfortunately we the people lack the discipline ourselves to see true educational reform happen. We do not like to evolve and change. My high school sciences teacher always stated that variety promotes survival if the environment changes. Well, the educational environment has changed yet we do not have a variety in educational access because we the people lack this discipline.

Off of my soap box now. 

[Horse Puckey]

Amazing, isn't it? You can have a beautiful, verdant field full of grasses waving in the breeze, gorgeous wild flowers dotting the landscape, and witness an amazing display of nature. Add in one horse, and sonner or later you will have the addition of a bit of horse puckey. Interesting how it is to this one bit of displeasure in the entire field that the flies gather around. Kinda like the news flies at a Saint Patrick's Day parade, huh?

[Adam]

No comment from anyone? Have I truly solved the issue? When should I address the KC School Board? Sign me up!

[Lisa]

Adam,

Where do you live? I'll take a big guess & that it is not within the inner 435 corridor. How can you claim pride in the community when you don't even live in the community. You see, that is the thing. Most of you want to solve everyone else's problems but don't realize that those living within the inner 435 corridor need to own & solve their own problems before there will be any sense of pride. Let us know when you are able to convince your neighbors to stand up & fight for a better life for them & their children & then maybe you can address your LOCAL school board members.

[Adam]

Lisa,

Wise comments! I live in Kansas City, MO. I am 1 mile outside of the 435 corridor. My school district happens to be the Liberty Schools. One of the pride an joys of the KC Metro area. Is there much violence up where I live??? No there isn’t. Why might I ask may be one of the reasons? I happen to live in a district where education is prominent and people care about their future and education. When I talk about community pride I am talking about Kansas City pride. I do not have to live in a certain area of the city to say that we should all take pride in our city which means invest in its future. To invest in ones future means being educated. Lisa, don’t make excuses. The title of this forum happens to be, “St. Pat's organizer: What more can we do? I am trying to come up with solutions. I am not trying to restate the problems like people tend to speak on.

Do you see Alvin Brooks solving any problems? He lives in the 435 corridor. Yes, he may make some points in front of a microphone when it is convenient. What about the other inner 435 corridor councilmen? Sandra McFadden Weaver? What about the black community activist that always comes out and bashes the police whenever he gets the time because everything in the inner city is racist this and racist that.

Where do you live Lisa? Johnson County? Let me guess. You are probably a liberal excuse maker as well instead of a take action individual.

[Adam]

Lisa,

My apologies for bringing politics into this specific forum. I am passionate about Kansas City. I just hate to see people in higher positions not solving the problems that reflect Kansas City’s image whether North or South of the River. We are one KC. I am a young 25 year old educated man who would like to do more for my city. I am not in a position of power except to vote for these officials who I have lambasted. You do agree that education is one key crime solver. Parade or no parade this city has bigger issues that need solved.

[Uncle Jay]

I'm not going to say anything about whether someone is a liberal excuse maker or not - I'm pretty liberal myself - but one of the biggest problems in this community is the question "Where do you live?"

It's like once you know the answer to that question, you know the person. Well no, you don't. I'm a Kansas Citian, whether I live in KC or not. If everyone would get that mindset problems would become OURS and not just THERES. We would work to solve problems instead of running away from them.

[Uncle Jay]

It helps if I spell THEIRS correctly. :)

[Lance]

I am a very proud black American (i've never been to africa). I grew up in the "hood" 24th vanbrunt around the "THUGS" you people are so afraid of.
I have to admit, me being a young black man i get sick to my stomach. When i hear about thease young "thugs", and the fights. But what i hate must of all is, the parents who get on t.v. upset that their child was mudered. Where were u at? momma, and dad?
where?

Coretta king passed away, but what i cant belive is that we are living her husbands dream.
the young "thugs" need everyones help. i dont care what color your skin is. we all should be in the hood helping out. i hear alot of black leaders today saying help your own, but thats wrong!! YOU ARE TEACHING SEGREATION!! you are no better thhan the KKK or any other racist group. thats is purely wrong.. we are all americans. all are!
stop calling them thugs, it seems to me u really wanna say (racial slur for black people)!

i've seen young white lady flash for geen beads at the preade. what are they called?

(edited by Greg Reeves)

[Uncle Jay]

"i've seen young white lady flash for geen beads at the preade. what are they called?"

Amie D.? Just kidding.

[Julie]

Here is a copy of a letter I sent to the K.C. Star:

To journalists Matt Campbell and Christine Vendel:

It is very troubling that violence broke out at the St. Patrick's Day parade. The committee and the city have worked very hard to eliminate any problems so that it can be a safe, family event. I don't know what else could have been done, short of gun control legislation, but that's another article, isn't it?

My husband is part of a group of parade participants, who, on the morning of the parade each year, go in costume to Children's Mercy Hospital to entertain the sick children who obviously can't come to the parade. It is the highlight of the year for him. So imagine my dismay when his face fell as he looked at the front page of the Kansas City Star the day after the parade. What was the focus and emphasis? Problems caused by a handful of hooligans; not the good done by many. Where was the article on the visit to Children's Mercy? The hard work and dedication of those who build the floats? The great additions of the big balloons and Mickey Mouse this year? The work of the committee to clean up the parade, make it for families--take the emphasis off drinking that always seems to accompany St. Patrick's Day in this country?

All the events needed to be reported--even the violence that occurred that day. But did it have to be the emphasis? What was your purpose? Does that pass for journalism these days?

I'm not a parade participant or a committee member--just the very disappointed wife of someone who gives his heart to those sick kids each year. Maybe you should look at the big picture next time.

Julie

[Adam]

Lancy, my friend:

You were alright until bringing the "n" word into the forum. But since you did. You know there is a difference between the words thugs and the "N" word. If not here is the definition and the context in which the term thug was used in this forum.

According to Webster’s Dictionary a Thug is a brutal ruffian or assassin. See also gangster. The definition of gangster is a member of a gang of criminals. In this scenario and forum we are properly using the term thugs because the group of criminals (15-20) happened to commit a crime of attacking individuals within a family.

I will not use political correctness when I speak and yes, these individuals are thugs. Whether you have a different definition other than Webster’s is your own personal problem.

Thugs can be of any particular color. Quit being part of the problem and start being part of the solution. You were off to a great start. Now finish your thought without being defensive with the terms used. It is okay to use Thugs when it is the true definition of the word. We all know there are black trash as well as white trash out there.

[Uncle Jay]

Going back a little now, I think someone missed the point earlier when they said the new arena will be a failure. What Mary Nestel in the original article was saying is that if the bad news is covered with the same veracity as the good by the Star, they create the perception that they truly are equal. They just simply are not equal. To the vast majority the parade was one of the best in years. Like I said earlier, if a Chiefs game was covered by The Star the way the parade is, no one would go to Chiefs' games.

[Crime Scene KC]

Thirty comments in this thread before the first racial slur (see Lance's comment, above).

One slur begets another. Please let's make it the last.

Thanks,
Greg Reeves

[Uncle Jay]

Very nicely done, Julie. Well said.

[Scott Quinn]

I have been to many Chiefs games where there was plenty of drinking going on and I have never seen anyone beaten by a mob or pulled out of his car. The real questions just beg to be answered, like why the police do not arrest kids who are at the parade during school hours without a parent or a guardian. The police have no problem violating rights and inconveniencing hundreds of drivers looking for "drunk" drivers, but they obviously do not take thugs seriously.

To Erin, actually we are not saying the same thing. The Parade Committee is irresponsible for continuing to hold the parade downtown. Forget that the parade is a waste of money, time and good will that the Irish community can desperately use. The organizers continue to promote the parade and run the parade as some "big party" for the city.

Maybe if the parade had a religious theme to it (unlikely, given the nominal Catholicism of many of this city's Irish "leaders") we would not have a problem. People who act like thugs generally are not interested in events like that.

By the way, Mary Nestle: Please define "certain people." What does this mean? Code phrases are so...British.

[Missy]

I JUST HAVE ONE COMMENT: JUST ABOUT EVERYBODY ON HERE BLAMED THE "YOUNG BLACK THUGS" FOR THE VIOLENCE Did you ever stop to try and figure out why? Were they disrespected? Did they feel threatened? And if the "white" community is so concerned chip in your tax dollars and help these "young black thugs" gain a better education. Get them school books and good teachers like Overland Park has. Chip in your tax dollars to aid successful futures for them.. The problem is hopleness for a generation that EVERYBODY wants to complain about, but NEVER lends a hand. Pray for them.

[jimmy]

Once again blaming the event on the actions of humans. That parade did not cause the f those losers to act inappropriate. When are we going to start policing our own. Raise your kids to respect themselves and others and none of this would occur. To often we let bad parenting go unpunished. Any fool can breed. The lack of proper upbrining causes the rest of society to deal with the aftermath. Look it is not like downtown area is booming with beauty and peace. St Patricks day has become idiot day. Let's face it. Drinking and fighting. Have of those morons could not fight their way out of wet paper bag unless they have a dozen drugs in their system

[Angela]

I, AS WELL AS A FRIEND, WERE ALSO IN THE MIDDLE OF THE VIOLENCE AND POLICE CHASING DOWN A "GUNMAN" AT 16TH OR 17TH AND GRAND AT ABOUT NOON. IN FACT, I WAS PUSHED INTO A BABY STROLLER (LUCKILY EMPTY) BY A POLICE OFFICER RUNNING AND PUSHING PEOPLE OUT OF HIS WAY. BUT, I HAVE TO SAY THAT I FEEL AS THOUGH A HUGE PART OF THE PROBLEM ARE THE NEW BAROCADES THAT ARE LINING THE STREETS. IT LITTERALLY TOOK US OVER 45 MINUTES TO WALK LESS THAN 2 BLOCKS FROM 16TH AND GRAND TO 18TH AND GRAND. THE FRUSTRATION OF THE "HERDED" CROWD WAS OBVIOUS. EVERYONE TRYING TO WALK WAS GETTING ANGRY AT EVERYONE ELSE WHO WAS PUSHING THEIR WAY THROUGH THE CROWD. IT SEEMED AS THOUGH LAST YEAR THE CITY LEFT US A LITTLE MORE WALKING ROOM BETWEEN THE BUILDINGS AND THE BAROCADES, WHICH MADE IT EASIER TO WALK. I ALSO HAVE NOT SEEN ANY REPORTS ON HOW MANY ESTIMATED PEOPLE WERE PICK-POCKETED DURING THIS "HERDING OF CATTLE" THROUGH THE STREETS. I KNOW PERSONALLY OF AT LEAST 2 PEOPLE THIS HAPPENED TO. IT'S A SHAME THAT MOST OF THE PEOPLE WHO WERE IN THE SAME GENERAL AREA AS I WAS FEEL LIKE THIS PARADE WAS A DISASTER AND WILL MOST LIKELY NEVER BE BACK. THANK GOD FOR SNAKE SATURDAY!

[Adam]

Scott, My boy (sorry, had to do a little Dr. Evil from Austin Power's),

Again, we are making excuses. Self control. We all should be taught this from our parents. The gentleman who worked at the Star who was attacked wasn't being mouthy at all. He wasn't "racist" either. He allowed various people of various colors access to stand on his truck to view the parade. He shared his sodas and other fun parade watching entertainment material. This guy was less than 10 feet behind me. I am a people watcher and thus I saw the fight first handed. Thugs (true definition) do not need excuses to comment criminal offenses.

Also, as stated earlier. There is plenty of money spent per capita in the KC school district. Money doesn't always generate wanted outcomes. I came from a small farm community. We didn't have much in terms of money being poured into our schools yet our graduation rate was the highest in the county. Not all problems are solved by throwing money at them.

[Uncle Jay]

Scott,

Just a few points. I missed the part where someone got pulled out of a car. There are assaults at Chiefs games. Do you take children to Chiefs games? Many schools were on spring break last week. Is it irresponsible for anything to be held downtown, NAIA, conventions, car show, etc.? What money is being wasted? Show me where the parade is promoted as a big party. You obviously don't know what you are talking about - signed the Gaelic Mass

[Adam]

Again, I must apologize. This post is confusing as to who writes what. My message to Scott was intended I think for the Missy post.

Sorry Scott.

[Scott Quinn]

Adam,

Love the Dr. Evil. I totally agree; you have no argument from me. Still, I do believe that the Parade Committee does need to accept responsibility as well.

[Uncle Jay]

What would you have the parade committee do? If you only solution is to move the parade from downtown then you are not solving the problem, you are running from it.

To Missy,
Would you threaten a group of twenty people the opposite race of you if there where only two of you? Commen sense.

[Erin]

Well Scott I guess you are right...we weren't saying the same thing. I don't think the parade committee was being irresponsible. They have been trying to stick to the roots of this parade and support the city by keeping a fun and family friendly (at least in content) event in the heart of the city. It is interesting...last year the parade started an hour earlier and absolutely none of these problems occured. Maybe pushing it back to 10:00 would be a positive change again. Apparently people looking for trouble don't like to get up that early. I would like to say one last thing... a few posts have mentioned drunk people causing trouble. I don't believe drinking has been the issue here. It wasn't a crowd of crazy drunk people who beat up that family or fired any shots. It was the kids we have been talking about whether they are thugs or not. Kids who should never have had a gun in the first place. Where are their parents or anyone who is accountable for them?? My mom and I were talking about this topic yesterday. When she and my dad were younger and would go party at the parade (20 plus years ago)....NONE of these problems accoured and I guarantee that there was WAAAY more drinking going on! It is a change in society and that is the root of the problem the needs to be solved.

[Scott Quinn]

Uncle Jay,

You really do not think the parade is promoted as a big party? Are you nuts? Why would anyone go to the thing if it were not a party? I am unaware of assaults at the Chiefs game like the type described in the paper. Fair enough point regarding spring break--that probably did account for a lot of kids. Downtown is cool, and I am always glad to see events being held there. Still, there is an obvious problem with the parade being held there. Finally, don't assume religiosity just because of a Gaelic Mass--if it can even be called a Mass.