St. Pat's organizer: What more can we do?

St. Patrick's Day Parade organizer Mary Nestel isn't happy with front-page news like this:

• Shots were fired, and a family was brutally attacked by youths in a parking lot near 16th Street and Grand Boulevard.Police broke up at least 10 fights, tackled a gunman and nearly shot a juvenile who had a toy gun.
• In one attack Friday, a Kansas City Star employee and his family were kicked and beaten toward the end of the parade in one of the newspaper’s parking lots. A witness and Star security officials said one youth shot a gun into the air.
• Star story Saturday: Violence returns with gunfire, beatings, arrests

I called Mary this morning to see what, if anything, might be done differently next year.

"What more can we do?" she said. "We can’t tell certain people not to come down. It’s Kansas City’s largest single-day event, so aside from charging people to come...

"Where are our leaders in Kansas City to start looking at these, as the police called it, young thugs? Because the police did their jobs. They were all out there. We did not cut back in staffing. We even bought more barricades.

"We did our job by putting on an unbelievably successful parade. You could tell that by the thousands of people who came down and had a great time. And then a small 1 percent had to have a bad time thanks to some young thugs. Why were they even there?"

She told me she still hasn't seen a police report, and expects to meet with police later this week. She didn't like The Star placing the arrests story next to the parade recap on the front page Saturday:

"What are you guys going to do when that Arena opens and there’s a huge concert and everyone comes outside and about two blocks of cars are broken into and 10 people get mugged?" she said. "Are you going to put that right next to it? How is it going to be successful? It's not."

Update: Thursday, March 23, 2006:
I thought it would be helpful to put meeting updates, TV/radio links on the topic, etc. here.

Tonight: KCPT's Ruckus, 7-7:30 p.m., will discuss the parade, among other topics.

On Friday, the public television station's Week in Review program will also have the parade as a topic at 7:30 p.m.

On Monday, Kansas City police will conduct an internal review of their deployment and performance at the parade. Spokesman Capt. Rich Lockhart has also responded on this blog to a critic.

A report on the parade requested by Mayor Kay Barnes will be presented to the Kansas City Police Board at 9 a.m. Tuesday.

The Kansas City St. Patrick's Day Parade Committee will hold its wrap-up meeting Wednesday.

I'd be glad to add/link to other meetings, events or shows.

Comments

[Festy]

Thank you Mary Nestel and the Parade Committee for hosting one of KC's best annual events!

[Uncle Jay]

Maybe your friends promote the parade as a big party, but where does the parade committee promote it as a big party? People (I guess this is an assumption) go to parades to see the floats. Ask the ones that go to the American Royal, Brookside, Snake Saturday, Martin City, etc. Are all these just excuses to drink and cause trouble?

I don't understand your comments about the mass, but I'm not Catholic so I'll just let it go.

[dh]

Get rid of this event just an excuse for the "black thugs to come out of the hood ". I for one wish one of the thugs would get shot . Alvin Brooks what a laugh hes just out for the Blacks in Kansas City . It's time for Blacks to act live civilized people or go back to Africa !

Well I am Catholic, and a very involved one at that. I am not sure why you feel that the Gaelic Mass shouldn't be called a Mass. Scott, I respect the fact that you are on here voicing your opinion but I am baffled by the hypocricy and judgement that your comments about the parade committee seem to be laced with. Please visit the parade website www.kcirishparade.com and point out to me where the parade is promoted as a big huge party. Or tell me on the tv or radio advertisements where they encourage people to come and party during the parade. If anything they stress and stress that due to city law there is no drinking allowed on the street and with themes like An Irish Tribute to Walt Disney and the additions of giant balloons, they are encouraging the entertainment and family aspects of this event.

[Adam]

DH,

Go back to school and learn true American history. Blacks didn't leave Africa by choice. They were sold into slavery by other blacks. Same as we see in today's society. Blacks are slaves to themselves by themselves.

Now, unless there is a better country out there other than the US I would say we are all fortunate enough to be Americans. Pick a better country. I bet you cannot.

[scott]

Thug - derived from Thuggee. Generally taken to mean a ruffian, a miscreant, a person who behaves in an aggressive manner towards others.

These kids are thugs. Plain and simple. Everybody is blaming the city, the parade, or the black community of Kansas City. What about the parent(s) of these kids with not keeping track of what their child does, hang around, or whatever? Appearantly they weren't taught the difference between right and wrong.These kids doing the beating and the ones cheering them on, need to be taken behind a shed and beaten with a shovel. Maybe that would knock so common sense into them. Doesn't matter where you live or what color you are, everybody needs to teach their children about RESPECTING others and self improvement through learning how this world operates.

All sorts of people who look different from one another cause problems at the parade.

I haven't gone to the last three because of my last experience there with a raunchy drugged up person, a gun incident and a bunch of jerks making toxic waste clouds by burning rubber in a parking lot just as I went by. The police were on the roof of a building right by it and did nothing but watch.

If I want to watch the parade, I'll tune in channel 9.

It seems that this discussion is going a little deeper than just a few insodenses at the St. Patricks Day parade. We are not going to solve the problem if we are at each others throats.

I honestly believe that the city does all it can do with what it has to work with as far as security is concerned. It sounds as if some of the folks on this forum want the entire police dept. to be down at the parade watching over them. That's not going to happen. To me it seems like the city is steadily trying to improve the security year by year. 500 - 1500 police officers can't watch over 100,000 people and be able to stop every crime that occurs, that's impossible!!!

It seems to me that some of these folks think that the world is a happy place and just because they go out to or live in certain places nothing bad should happen to them. This is NOT the case. Always, always, always be aware of your surroungs. You know the thing that makes me laugh the most is when I'm watching the news, and a crime occurs in Olathe, Leawood, Lee's Summit, or Overland Park, the people always say,"...this type of stuff isn't suppose to happen here!" I guess just because there are not poor disadvatage black or white people in their part of town, then it should be crime free.

I am a young black man who didn't grow up in the 'hood'. I grew up in a middle class black neighborhood just outside of Raytown, I went to Raytown schools along with other blacks who didn't grow up in the 'hood'. From my experiences, it seems that trouble down in the 'hood' isn't a black thang, it's a poor thang. Contrary to the beliefs of some people who read these columns and post on this forum, not all black people are murdering, theiving "thugs". It's just painted that way through the media. Now, I know that some people will get bent out of shape because of what I wrote, but I not all of you guys are racist, but there is that small percentage. Blacks being depicted evil, crime lovin' "thugs" goes back hundreds of years.

Unfortunately, a huge number of blacks are poor and they live in the poorest part of town, and a lot of the folks take on a poor mind set which leads to them acting out their frustrations in a negative fashion. The same could be said for poor whites in certain areas. So the arguement of black leaders need to do something about this is garbage. This is an AMERICAN problem that needs to be addressed, not just a black problem. Think about folks, black people make up only 12% of the nation, we can't be causing all of the trouble.

Anyway, the security problems will never go away, but can and needs to be reduced. The racial problems, unfortunately will probably never go completely away, but it too can be greatly reduced through educational measures and understanding.

[Scott Quinn]

Okay, call it an event instead of a party.
Please explain how I am a hypocrite. I have nothing against anyone on the parade committee (I don't think I even know anyone on it), I just think they need to do something regarding the parade to make it safer (like not having it) or quit whining about the coverage from the Star.

Regarding the GM, I should not have brought it up. It's not relevant to this discussion, but I do not think anything having to do with Vatican II is legit.

[Pete]

Scott Quinn,

Regarding the "authenticity" of the annual Gaelic Mass - I think I'd much rather trust Bishop Raymond Boland's assessment of that event than yours.
God Bless.

[Missy]

Dh: You are very intelligent.. Keep up the good work! (and I HOPE you know that was a PUN) I am not going to waste my time on your comment. Adam, I believe that is who addressed me, I understand your position.. and I have nothing to say about it because your situation and others, prove successful.. however I feel like it is slightly different because of the times and society. I am not saying that their behavior was right, by no means, but ignorance (like dh) can improve with knowledge. I think that they should take full responsiblity for their actions and yes the parenting is a MAJOR issue.. but we are talking about a cummunity that is diminishing due to ignorance. The parents are uneducated and so what can they teach the children? I just posed the question b/c people are so quick to judge never TRYING to see the reason.

[mika]

I think that this type of crime happens every where in the general KC area from Overland Park, Lenexa, Blue Springs and etc. The kids who were there might have been on Spring break and there was no school. Everytime there is a problem in our community someone alway wants to blame the young black males. I was at the parade myself and I felt uncomfortable as a young black woman, yes there is some young black males that need a whoopin and I said whoopin all of them are not generally that way. My trouble was with some of the young drunk white males and females just like Blacks, Whites have a problem to they were very disrespectful and have no compassion for us either. I was called so many vulger names just for trying to walk down the crowded streets from the N word to a b&*ch. They might not go aroung fighting but they are just as unruley as the young blacks. I think that the problem lies within the city of Kansas City Missouri, they make sure that they keep the races segragated as far as in schools and social environments. It is okay for the white kids to hang out on Noland Rd and socialize but its not oaky for the blacks to hang out on Prospect or even a public park with out being chased out by police when there is no problems. Its the community leaders not the community.

david-

Look at the murder rate statistics, this city is high up there for the amount of people who actually live here to the number of people murdered. Gary Indiana (AKA East Chicago) was the murder capitol of the world, but its not in downtown chicago, in fact i feel safer walking down michigan avenue at night than I do Broadway in KC, get your facts right moron

[Adam]

Mika,

Mika,

We all segregate ourselves. No longer do we live in a country where one person is forced to live in a certain place. The last time that happened was in WWII with the Japanese internment camps. We go where we feel the most comfort and have the greatest opportunity for ourselves and our prosperity.

There is generally a lack of discipline in all communities. Lack of knowledge about one another. Lack of understanding and also a blame someone else for the demise of some instead of people blaming themselves. Examples: It is the governments fault I am on welfare, or it’s the white person fault I can’t get a good education, or it is the black person’s fault that I feel unsafe. Quit blaming others and we should all take the blame as parents and future parents. Discipline (not beatings) but true discipline and teaching basic right and wrong, allowing teachers to discipline their classes, etc…

Quit pointing one finger and start concentrating on the three fingers that point back at us when we point one at others.

[Baine]

Mr. Quinn,

I must take you to task on your comments regarding the fact that the Committee runs the parade as a giant drunk fest. You could not be further from the truth. The Kansas City St. Patrick's Day Parade Committee is made up of not only volunteers from the KC metro community but of also civic leaders and local personalities that give their time to make the parade the best product they can for Kansas City. What you are looking at is one day in the life of the parade. You must look deeper and look at what the Committee does for the city. Whether it is being involved with the chamber, local charities such as Harvester’s and Ozanam, local hospitals or the Irish community, the Committee ALWAYS puts its best foot forward. I could drone on and on about the events city wide they are involved in, but I will pare it down to one, since you brought religion into this. Gaelic mass at Redemptorist Parish. The Parade Committee is a proud supporter and Organizer of the evening mass every year held on "Snake Saturday". For that, the Committee asks for no recognition and no media coverage. Why is that do you think? Because the committee does not need the spotlight. They would rather their actions speak for themselves. Bottom line here is that this in my opinion, one of the best events the Committee puts on throughout the course of the year.My guess, Mr. Quinn is that you couldn't even tell me where Redemptorist is, let alone honestly tell me you have attended that mass. If you want to throw Catholicism into it, and say the parade should be religious themed and not a “big party”, where were you sitting when I was collecting at that mass?

Mr. Quinn, I must ask you where inside your mind do the words Walt Disney, Radio Disney; Thank you, Walt Disney; Children's Mercy Hospital; Mickey Mouse; Brogenn's Brigade; and the Go For the Green Food Drive become synonymous with some "big party" and not the true underlying theme for the parade- "a family event." The Organizers of this wonderful event in Kansas City cannot be and should not be held responsible for the actions of a few. Without divulging numbers, I can tell you with absolute certainty, as an ex-police officer, that the manpower on hand from the KCMOPD and the Committee was plenty to handle the already shortened parade route. There is only one person that can be responsible for their actions and that person is each individual. Personal responsibility is something that no one has touched on here.

So, before you go blaming the City, the Committee, the third shooter on the grassy knoll the Easter Bunny, the tooth Fairy and everybody else but the individual, look inside yourself and understand that it all boils down to a choice..

"I can be a good, civic minded citizen, or I can be a thug."

Plain and simple. So, What's it going to be for you, Mr. Quinn? You want to help make it better? Come to a meeting, get involved and help out. Otherwise, don't bash the Committee for what they are trying to do to make this a great event for everyone involved.

Thug life...man...yeah...these kids live in a place where there are no fathers, and in turn no disciplin. They sell drugs and carry guns because it is the quickest way to get rich and get out of the ghetto. typically the youth of the ghetto is just killing each other black on black crime, if it turns to black on white or white on black then we are going to have a serious problem.

I think the black communitty often forgets about the majority of the white communitty that is not rich and hates black people as much as they hate us. RURAL America is just as bad and they are waiting.

Both black and white people with educations and a will to succeed and life are trying to make this whole situation work. It is only the uneducated dope dealing thugs, meth dealing red-necks who pose a problem. Lets not forget this.

[mowater]

I found a number of comments and observations that I whole heartedly agree with. The one that caught my eye is if the roles were reversed with white youth beating up black families it would be a federal offense and we would likely be reading about riots in midtown. The part that really surprised me was the number of people whom were watching these thugs do their dirty work. Why? "In name of all that is right" would you not take action and make some kind of an attempt to intervene. One big reason these thugs do it is because "They Can".
If man and woman alike regardless of color would had stepped in it would had sent a clear message that this type of actions were not acceptable.
For the Johnson County person that seemed to think that a comment made from one of the members of the assaulted white family, was the cause of their assault...Shame on you! That's the biggest load of crap I have ever heard.
The thinking that if you remain silent and ignore what is taking place, you'll be exempt from any kind of abuse.
You obviously have not been around the block very many times.
My final thought is that the people watching this take place likely were cowards. I saw a similiar type of incident at Worlds of Fun when a group of young blacks would push and cut in at the head of the long lines to one of the rides, not once but, several times.The next time they came up they made the big mistake of cutting in front of my family, that included my wife and three small children. The thugs found that not everyone looks the other way. I am pleased to say that they underestimated several law abiding citizens and their intolerance to their disrespect for others. I personally was involved and I believe it'll be long time before this particular group of hoods try that again.
It's time to stand up for what's right. This political correct thinking is wrong and hope for those of you whom are offended will continue to look the other way.

Mika-

Who got in the drunken driving accident the killed and injured innocent people? Who attacked people at the parade while their dumb *ss buddies cheered them on. Who was packing heat at the parade? All young black men, not one of them was white, Mexican, Asian, European, no my friend they were all black. Get over yourself and start recognizing the problem within your community b/c you are the only one they will listen too. If black women would stop glorifying these idiots and refused to be with them, maybe it would wake up the young black youth in America.

You know I will admit this, it was probably some white hippie smoking the grass, and at a family event this is uncalled for and the idiots should have been arrested.

[scott]

Are we ever going to stop making EXCUSES for ignorance. I blame bad parenting. It is nobodies fault except for these dumbasses and their parents. People like this are the trash of our society. (This doesn't mean any particular group so calm down some of you). Trash is trash, no matter what the color of your skin.

[Adam]

Mowater,

I will admit that I was a coward (I happen to be black and white mixed). There were 15-20 thugs who were beating this family. Once the fight started there was an even bigger crowd of black youths cheering the group on. Add all of those individuals together that would total about 30-50 blacks cheering or participating in the action. I am one man by myself like I said who happens to be black. Thoughts ran through my mind to help. I motioned the police to the activity. If I would have run to the rescue of those being beaten I could have been included as one of the ones doing the beating. Could have been arrested, lost my job working at a downtown bank as a Sr. Project Analyst, thus lost my job, my income to pay for my newly built house, and future earnings potential for being arrested. We let the law get involved as is needed. Didn't have the man power or the weaponry to make a citizen's arrest.

Once again sir. Common sense prevailed. I didn't even leave immediately after the altercation happened for fear that running away from the threat would make me appear to be guilty of something I wasn't guilty of.

[Scott Quinn]

Baine, you are not very focused in your reply. My comments did not deal with bashing the committee per se. Good for them for bringing good to the city. I do not care if you are an ex-cop or ex-con, you are plainly wrong to state that there was adequate police protection--not when people are being beaten by mobs. Your silly comments regarding Redemptorist do not merit a response.

Here's a question for you, ex-cop (or con). When/if you were a cop and parents of teens hosting a party were present after you responded to a complaint at the residence, did you tell the parents to not worry about it since since each person has a responsibility for his actions? I bet not, nor should you have. In the same way the Parade Committee should do the honorable thing and cancel the parade, since (through no fault of their own) it always gets out of hand.

Consider this my civic duty.

[Uncle Jay]

It's not honorable to walk away from a problem and let others deal with it.

[Brian]

To Scott:
Why the hell should we help raise your kids? Do it right and they wouldn't be "hopeless".

[Erin]

Scott...I guess maybe hipocricy may have not been the best choice of words. My frustration comes from the fact that I can't seem to figure out exactly where it is you stand on all of this. First you say that the committee is irresponsible to keep the parade downtown. But then you say that downtown isn't the problem and that you would support any other event downtown. Then you say that the parade should take more responsibilty to make it safer...well which is it? The parade committtee is a group of VOLUNTEERS who have a love for this Kansas City tradition. They HIRE the Kansas City Police force to come and make the parade safe. I just don't know what more they could...

[Scott Quinn]

Erin, yes you are correct, I have not been very precise in my language and I apologize for that. Let me try again and hopefully do a better job. Downtown is, like I said, a pretty cool place and it is fun to go to various events down there. However, none of the other events involves cramming people together in quite the same way as the parade does. Part of the problem is, of course, that it is a free event, so there is nothing to stop anyone from coming down. My problem with the Committee is that they continue to have the parade downtown and all these problems happen. Then KC gets a link on the national AP wire screaming that violence--once again--comes to the parade in KC. The Committee can, as I wrote earlier, whine about it or simply stop having it downtown. But as hosts of the event they cannot throw up their hands and pretend like they have no role in the solution.

[scott]

-Why is everyone pointing the finger at everyone elese except for the ones who acted like fools during the parade? The police, and parade organizers didn't go around beating people up. It was these morons who committed this cowardly act against a family. The kids are the ones who the cancer here. Why don't they have undercover cops next. Two or three for each block of the parade and see what happens.

[mowater]

To the kind person that suggested we give more of our hard earned tax dollars to accomodate the thugs and their opportunity to education. I have to wonder about all the people whom, attended one room schools years ago that operated on very little capital or tax assistance. Those kids were educated and grew up to be valuable members of our community. This is a lesson in economics. The problem here is not money or taxes, rather the basic and fundamental reality that thugs do not regularly attend school or if they are then they are not applying themselves. Bottom line!!!
Last the concept that those viewed as poor have that as an excuse to be disrespectful and disobey the laws of the land. Thank God during the depression they didn't know that this was an option for their behaviour. It's truly is time to stop making excuses and understand that young people need to know right from wrong then help them with a reality check to understand the results to bad actions towards other people and property!
Thank you Dr. Spock for screwing up an entire generation believing it is wrong to discipline your children.

[Erin]

Scott- I think it is hard for the committee to give up on something that they have worked so hard on just because of one small group of people. If you aren't involved in the committee you just can't possibly understand. We put so much heart and sole into this event along with all the others we do through the year. I would say that 75% of us do it because we are so proud of our Irish Heritage and love that there is an entire day that the whole city can celebrate with us. I would say the other 25% are a part of it because they love this city and they love being involved in great civic organizations. We just aren't willing to give up. Like I mentioned earlier....last year according the the KCPD standards...there were ZERO incidents. And the parade was in the exact same location with the same barricades and crowds...for some reason the small percentage of trouble makers just didn't go. Again...maybe it was because they didn't feel like waking up that early...I just don't know. But it is really frustrating that MY national holiday....MY heritage gets pissed on and dragged through the mud because of poor choices that other people make.

[mowater]

To Scott,

I appreciate your integrity. Your concern and desire to help was noble. You are right in that you represented just one person. If 50 or 60 "Scott type of people" had the same heart then it could had been different. Then again sometimes we have to take one for the gipper and say what the heck and jump in. Thank you Scott for desiring to do right. I mean it!

[Erin]

One thing I forgot to mention...I don't think it is fair to say the committee has thrown up their hands and pretend that we shouldn't have any role int he solution. As I mentioned earlier...we do a lot to try to remedy the situation. You wouldn't believe the amount of money that goes into these efforts. The barricades alone are over $30,000. Also, we pay for the police to be down there. This isn't something the KCPD or the city gives us for free. And if you have ever worked on an event that required the help of KCPD then you know it isn't cheap. These may seem like very superficial solutions to you but as a volunteer organization we have to go with the reccomendation of the cioty and KCPD and those are the regulations they gave us to make things safer. Besides pulling the parade out of downtown, what would be a non-superficial solution to the problem??? Help us out here!!! I don't think runnign from downttown is the best solution...

[Joshua]

Erin I have to totally agree with your statements. I worked as a volunteer for the Irishfest and I participate in Irish Heritage all year not just one day as an excuse to get drunk. I was at 16th and Grand. I witnessed some of the problems that were there. I smelled the pot and saw the fights. I don't know what the solution is, but if a 6:00 AM parade solves the problems I'll go to a 6:00AM parade.

[Crime Scene KC]

Hi mowater,

I could be wrong, but it sounds like you meant your most recent comment to be directed at Adam, not Scott (the commenter before and after Adam).
It's a very easy mistake to make. This blog interface (TypePad) is confusing. First comes the comment, then a separating line, then the date/time and commenter's nick.
I hope this helps.

Greg Reeves

[Solid Citizen]

This colloquy seems like some kind of civic hallucination. And the first casualties are truth and balance in reporting and discussing events. St. Pat's Day has become an increasing problem for this community, be it at the parade in/near Downtown or in Westport. Drunken thugs and rowdies of all description are drawn out on the streets like they had a cosmic hall pass. Don't need it in my neighborhood (near Westport), thank you. Gatherings of all kinds have become almost impossible in the city, because we have abject political cowardice about even the most basic issues of public order and political correctness so blinding that real discussion just falls off the table (at the newspaper most of all). Please don't anyone suggest that the Kansas City School District, wastrel of billions of dollar of public resources, hasn't been adequately supported. Please spare us the litany of failed urban liberal orthodoxies which produce only more boondoggles, not solutions. Those of us who have long fought the battle living in the city need not be insulted with the speaking in tongues, and please lets quit passing around the excuses. There was a shooting recently at the doors of Crown Center because a young "crowd" got out of hand. Westport was paralyzed for years weekend nights in good weather by sheer disorder -- years when no politico in this community would stand up and say diddly -- including her Honor, never-saw-a-public-spending-program-she-didn't-like. It is a lot more fun and giggly to go to ribbon cuttings for absurdly subsidized building projects and arenas and stadiums than do the heavy lifting of insisting on public order and building real communities. It is no "fun" at all to insist on decent public behavior. And if a term like "decent" sounds archaic and quaint, then maybe it is time to forget large public gatherings altogether. Except I can tell the person who wouldn't take kids to a 311 concert at Verizon -- I did just that with some middle schoolers a few years ago and the security was flawless, persistent and very visible. It can be done. Not even that may work on "Grand" Avenue, but if putting-on these things just means putting people at risk, then forget it. Or take it elsewhere, because the City of Kansas City isn't remotely up to the task of providing public safety. You have the St. Pat's Parade in Overland Park or Lee's Summit, if they will put up with it, and you will have a safe event -- or there will be no event. Simple as that.

[Misha]

To all -

Everyone writing here, for the most part, are all seeing the many pieces in this picture. Fundamentally, I do not believe, and I would imagine that the majority of readers feel the same, the event (parade) shouldn't be blamed for crime. Crime can happen anywhere, at any time. Of course, when you put large groups of diverse people all together crime can happen. There is always this risk within large community gatherings. Let me stress the word COMMUNITY! That's what we ALL are. The sad fact is that our community is suffering greatly and crime is one symptom. This is not a new statement by any stretch. The challenges have already been mentioned by the many people who have written earlier:

1) Parents need to take responsiblity for being their children's teachers, first and foremost.
2) Schools need to do the best they can to educate kids with the funding they are provided by the city. This means proper use and management of it, which can be one problem. If there isn't enough money, then how do we get more!
3) Churches need to outreach, outreach, outreach!
4) Civic leaders need to stop talking (and soap boxing) and start acting to build community bridges.
5) Media need to shut up! or report news that would be considered uplifting to all our spirits. How can good spirit ever come from bad news? And if you just have to report everything, for goodness sake, (as others have suggested) don't emphasize the negative! In order to have hope, our communities need to be given good news over the bad. I certainly see the media as being yet another way for some of the attention needing youth to get a means to their end.
6) Police - I know you are probably doing all that you can. Crime is what you try to deal with, but we can't blame it on you.
7) The City - boy can we really blame anything on such a vague abstraction. This comes down to the integrity of the Civic Leaders which I have already addressed minimally.
8) Businesses - Some, but not all, businesses near these large events, gain some financial benefit from having them nearby. Are they investing themselves enough in their community to be more profoundly impactful?

The Parade Committee are only one small group of people who try to bring some community good will and hope into Kansas City's downtown. They can't address all the other "jobs" listed above, but they are, I'm sure, willing to provide support for building bridges and trying to help others.

The problem with our youth is the bigger problem and the most troubling by far. How do we all, with each of our particular strengths, plan to address it appropriately? Mayor Barnes - Do I hear a reason for a townhall meeting or whatever a community forum is called these days?

[mowater]

Mr. Reeves,

Yes, you are correct.
I made the error of getting in a hurry, resulting in getting the names confused.
Please accept my apology gentlemen....

Thank you for the correction.

You remind me of a basketball coach I know.

[openmind]

A couple of FYI's to you doomsday prophets.

-Violent crime is actually at its lowest level ever recorded (as of 2004, most recent data I could find).

-mowater...I believe that those alive during the depression were aware that this was an option, seeing as how the homicide rates (the only statistic available) were at some of the highest rates in recorded history.

-While violent crime is no doubt one of the primary concerns for citizens of any country, there are certain factors that lead us to over exaggerate the problem. Murders are usually at the beginning of the news and are shocking. Humans remember shocking instances more readily than those which are mundane. Therefore, we think that this is a larger problem than what it really is. The fact is, we are much safer than we were 10 years ago.

-Minorities are overrepresented in media portrayal in nearly every negative category imaginable. For example, although they only make up about 40% of the people on welfare, they are shown in 80% of the footage accompanying stories on welfare. They are also overrepresented in violent crime stories.

-We tend to remember information that confirms our already held beliefs much easier than information that refutes those beliefs. For example, when we hear of a crime involving black people, and we already believe that black people commit a lot of violent crime, we remember that story more vividly and in more detail than a story about a white criminal. This is one of the main reinforces for prejudice, and involves more than just beliefs about crime. We look for information to support our hypotheses, not refute them.

-I agree with the poster from Raytown (I went to South myself). The biggest predictor of crime is income level. I truly believe that, although they wouldn’t admit it, poor whites have much more in common as far as lifestyle with poor black than they do rich whites. It is similar to the poster who commented on the redneck meth dealers.

-Because of the influence that poverty has on crime (refer back to the statistics on the 30's if you forget), I would have to say that it should be no surprise that they have a disproportionate number of people who turn to crime. There are a disproportionate number of blacks in poverty. This should come as no surprise considering that whites had a 200 year head start on their fortunes. To any white person who says that they need to bring themselves out of poverty, I would be willing to wager that for every white person who leaves poverty behind and becomes a success, there is a black individual who is just as strong.

-The bottom line is that the fight of crime is something that will be ongoing as long as the wealth disparity in this country continues to grow. In fact, even if this problem is solved, there will continue to be problems with crime. Rich people commit violent acts too!

[openmind]

To give up on those individuals who are most at risk for crime would be a disservice not only to them, but to ourselves as Americans. We are a nation that is remarkably fortunate compared with those around the globe, yet we all to often resort to a "I'm OK screw everyone else" retoric that is getting tired. I have had the privliage of living amongst both the poorest of the poor and the richest of the rich, and I can tell you that they are all good people inside. Some people have the fortune of never finding out what they are capable of given their surroundings. Those same people are the ones who are quick to discount the importances of the environment they are brought up in, and even quicker to attribute thier success to themselves. I hate to burst your bubble, but statistics show that you are giving yourself a little too much credit.

All the Best,
Openmind

I was more liberal when I was in college...now that I have to pay taxes I've become more conservative. Throwing money at a problem doesn't always help, it often breeds irresponsibility. (case in point - the Kansas City School District)

Bottom line, these thugs do not respect the St. Pat's tradition and are victimizing innocent paradegoers. I heard that Southeast High only had 100 students in attendance on St. Pat's Day. The rest were downtown "wilding." The problem can be traced back to the black youth gatherings 10 years ago at 63rd and Prospect that city leaders fought to stop, because of the violence and trouble that ensued. At one point Cleaver wanted to herd them into a drive-in theater lot, which didn't fly. Well, guess what...they moved all right, over to Westport. Now they go anywhere they want, which would be fine if they could act decent and refrain from shooting and thugging.

I predict one of the floats will get shot at in the next couple of years and the parade will move to Overland Park or NKC. Don't even get me started on the Power and Light District or the Sprint Center. They'll draw crowds alright...kids playing hooky looking to roll some tourists. I think the future of downtown is reflected in all this, and it ain't good.

I suspicion that the true mayhem at the parade may have been underreported. Our city leaders have a stake in keeping us "excited" about how great downtown is/will be.

Funny how the 'n' word is a no-no, unless blacks use it. in songs, to each other, on radio, on tv, in rap. our kids listen to the music with the 'n' word throughout. then, of course, they should automatically know not to use it. come on.

clean up your own house.

[openmind]

One of the previous posters does an excellent job of explaining why I find many conservatives so infuriating.

"I was more liberal when I was in college...now that I have to pay taxes I've become more conservative.”

So you really, really want to feed the poor, I just don’t want to have to pay for it. Someone should do some good, just as long as it doesn’t come out of my wallet. I am all for fiscal responsibility, however I dont hear too many conservatives bitching about the Iraq war even though it costs many billions more than any social aid program. When are conservatives going to realize that they have a responsibility to people beyond themselves? The rich wouldn’t be rich if it weren’t for the poor doing all of the grunt work and then giving them their money back by buying their products. I for one make a good amount of money, and have no qualms about giving more. I do agree that throwing money at a problem in an of itself does not make it better, but I promise you it makes doing good a whole heck of a lot easier.

[Steve]

Like it or not, you are being shown the future of downtown Sprint Arena, KCPL District call it what you wish. Some of these bleeding hearts will have to wake up and get out of their fantasy world they live in. I drove around downtown daily in the 80's the violence and the problems were there then but nobody cared because it was just downtown, land of the homeless and thugs. It will only get worse and until Kansas City Mo realizes you can't shine a turd no matter how hard you rub it or how much the wax costs it will always be a turd. Downtown is less than 3 blocks in any direction from for lack of a better term "ghetto", put on an event downtown and all it does is keeps the thugs from driving more than a mile to rob and assualt the inncocently ignorant suburbanites.

[Notta Thugg]

Hey Missy - get real. What could possibly be justification for thugs of any color to beat the crud out of a family? Bullies are just that - bullies. And there is simply no excuse for doing what they did - even if they felt "dissed."

Forget the racial agenda and just look at things in general. When is it justified to gang up and terrorize anyone?

openmind, I am not a conservative now, just more conservative. I voted for Kerry, for God's sake. I do not support the Iraq war because I think it was a sham from the get-go. However, that's another discussion. Yes, I want to feed the poor. I don't think I should have to feed them money from my pockets at gunpoint when they are wearing more expensive clothing than me and not paying to feed their own kids. The entitlement mentality is sickening, and believe me, from my vantage point, I see it every day. It doesn't do any of the future generations any favors, ours or theirs.

[Ryan C Da one and Only]

I hate, I repeat hate the way the gatekeepers portray the African-American community. For one incident an entire community is blamed. The whole matter should be taken care by the legal system. Let the law do it's job, and stop blaming the problem on everyone of color;instead blame the few "thugs" that did it. Would it be fair to say that the fraternity that was banned off our Campus at CMSU, for throwing a chicken and beer party, where they imitated the same thugs that beat the white family to a bloody pulp. Are these same "white boys" on Martin Luther King day when they drank 40ozs and wore brown mask and painted their faces to look black and make a mockery of black stereotypes a result of the entire white community of the U.S? Because they came from all over the U.S. If so, I should send a letter to the MuleSkinner and tell them to fix their problem. I'm advocate of peace, I grew up on 39th and South Benton in KC, my house was right in front of the bus stop. I know all about the hood and then I know about Lee's Summit, Grain Valley, Blue Springs. And to every cubby hole of our metropolitan area there are thugs, even whites ones. They drive Escalades with 22'' rims, they have wild meth parties, with tons of pot and lots of girls. Just like the hood. Corruption, violence, racism, lawlessness, and muder harbor in every city of America. If "y'all really gave a damn why doesn't the city spend money on after school programs, since the economy is rising and parents have to work to provide for their children. Instead of putting blockades up, why don't they involve the community publicly to help out with city-wide events. Why can't the city of Kansas City grow up and take responsibilty on our streets by enforcing compassion and understanding through the invisble barriers that separate our communities. When will we all take the blame,for being un-educated. The man that knows anything, knows that he knows nothing at all. So to ultimately learn we have to learn about ourselves by looking in the mirror first, and then offer a hand to help ourselves and then our brothers and sisters. Please stop the name calling and finger pointing. The truth is bulletproof. The proof is 100.

[openmind]

my apologies. In fact, I agree with you previous post. Steve, I do think that it is possible to bring downtown back to life. I have seen it work very successfully in other cities,all it takes is the correct approach. I do feel that your mentality will do nothing to psoitively contribute to the situation, in fact it will likely make things worse. If you prefer segregating yourself to attempting to remedy the problem, go right ahead and stay in Johnson County or Lee's Summitt. I will continue to support any intelligent and positive efforts to address the problem.

A quick biblical Economics lesson for Conservatives and Liberals who claim to be Christian:

The Bible describes two classes of poor people: the oppressed, who are victims of poverty due to outward circumstance, and the sluggards, who are poor due to their own laziness and irresponsibility.

Throughout the Bible, we see God repeatedly defending the cause of the oppressed, and calling on His people to do likewise. Jesus began His ministry by telling us that the oppressed poor were a primary focus of His concern: "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised, To preach the acceptable year of the Lord" (Luke 4:18-19).

The sluggards, on the other hand, are a different story. "Sluggards waste opportunities (Proverbs 6:9-10), bring poverty on themselves (Proverbs10:4)...and are unable to accomplish anything in life (Proverbs 15:19)...A sluggard is prideful and lustful (Proverbs 13:4)...wasteful (Proverbs 12:27)...and lazy (Proverbs 24:30-34)...Though he continually makes excuses for himself (Proverbs 22:13), his laziness will consume him (Proverbs 24:30-34), paralyze him (Proverbs 26:14), and leave him hungry (Proverbs 19:15)." (3) Strong words? Yes, but for a person in this category, help is all but impossible apart from genuine repentance before God and sincere desire to change. As Paul the Apostle solemnly commanded the church at Thessalonica: "If a man will not work, neither shall he eat (2 Thessalonians 3:10 )." www.james-dave.com and the Bible

Good post,
Most poor that I see are the sluggards. These are the ones who breed more sluggards in order to get more tax payers money. I have a problem with these leeches. I have no problem with the truly poor and downtrodden opressed unless these groups are oppressed for sluggard reasons. Example would be the individuals who go around as menaces to society during the parade last week.

[openmind]

That would be a valid point if I considered the bible in any way, shape, or form applicable to politics. Separation of Church and State? Thankfully our forefathers were intelligent enough not to put much faith in a bunch of STORIES put together thousands of years ago. Furthermore, those stories do a remarkable job of keeping social classes in check. "the meek shall inherit the earth." Spare me your biblical babble and come back to me when you study either politics or economics. It is your right to believe the bible if you choose, but do not try to run a country based on which make believe story you prefer. If we do that we are no better than Afghanistan. Hey, I believe in the Nordic tradition, so those "thug" warriors should be revered and shall live in Valhalla forever!!!! (Openmind, 2:16-5:17)

To Openminded - your last comment - NOT very "openminded" - IDIOT!

[Adam]

Actually Openminded,

That person made a valid point. Again, education is a key to success. You really need to study American History as well as the Constitution because there isn't any amendment, nor any clause in the US Constitution that remotely mentions Separation of Church and State. It was a memoire from Andrew Jackson who wrote about that subject.

Amendment 1 of US Constitution states:
CONGRESS shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free excercise thereof.

You may want to check out US Constitution for dumbies. I will pay it for opressed, uh I mean sluggards such as yourself.