Recommended: Whitlock on Cosby

Just my $0.02, but Star sports columnist Jason Whitlock had an outstanding column this morning on Bill Cosby's Call-Out here Tuesday, which drew about 2,000 persons to Penn Valley Community College:

Cosby gets his points across

• I wasn’t shocked at all by what I heard from Cosby on Wednesday. I’d heard it all before at the Million Man March. Cosby was plainspoken, direct and brutally honest.
• Cosby stated that too many black people have accepted the labels — “at-risk, disadvantaged and minority” — put on them by the mainstream media.
• “Harriet Tubman had to put a gun to some (slaves’) heads to get them off the plantation,” Cosby said, referring to the queen of the Underground Railroad. “You know why? Because some of us want to stay at-risk and disadvantaged.”

This blog is about crime, not race, but it's hard to ignore the intersection of the two in this country. Related topics have come up on this blog before and can be found in the One Kansas City? category.

As Jason says, Cosby's line has drawn much fire. Latest attack:

Standing up to Cosby's harsh attacks on poor blacks
Like the start of baseball season and the end of the school year, Bill Cosby's rants against the black poor are becoming a perennial feature of the impending summer. On the most recent stops along his 18-city "Call Out" tour, Mr. Cosby has reignited controversy by publicly attacking young black men.
While I don't question his love for black people, his recent actions have appeared more venomous than valuable, more condescending than caring and more hateful than helpful.
- Marc Lamont Hill, an assistant professor of urban education at Temple University, writing in the Baltimore Sun today.

PLEASE NOTE:

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Thanks,
Greg Reeves

Comments

[Danny]

The words "outstanding" and "Whitlock" should never be in the same sentence.

[Nate]

I don't think of this as a Black problem. I think this is a poverty problem. Break down the numbers. There are more white people in this position then any minority.

The sense of entitlement and hopeless oppression helps EVERYONE justify waiting in line to pick up that welfare check.

It's not racism that has created the problem, but it is racism that has focused this problem as being a "Black People" problem...

[The Angry Conservative]

Taking a brutally (but fair) take on matters like this make you a lightning rod for criticism. The fact that race is involved and the person making the comments is himself black ignites it further.

There is no "public attacking" when you ask an adult to be an adult. New Orleans being hit by Hurricane Katrina should clue people in to the idea that being government-reliant (in any fashion), is a really bad idea. And despite a population that is more than 2/3rds black, whites made up almost half of the original death toll in that city (despite what you'll see and hear from liberal news outlets such as CBS, ABC, and (to a certain extent) NBC.)

[David]

Thank you Bill Cosby and Jason Whitlock for caring enough to call it like you see it on this important issue. We are made with the capacity to choose and made to take responsibility for ourselves. This is not to say that social injustice is not real. There is something wrong in that a black male is statistically more likely to go to jail than to college - that is a societal injustice. Nevertheless, ghetto-fabulousness has got to go. As somebody that works with youth, I have even seen little Johnson County white boys trying to act all ghetto. Be who you are, but don't wait for "the man" to look out for your interests.

[LJ]

I'm not sure what the racial break down of the death toll from Katrina has to do with anything.

[lr]

LJ, I think Conservative was merely showing the amount of government reliant folks in Nawlins did not fall strictly to one race and he prefaced the whole paragraph with the statement that adults need to be adults, regardless of color.

[The Angry Conservative]

LJ:

I made the comment mostly because the coverage of Katrina has a very "whites are oppressing blacks" edge to it. There are plenty of poor white people in this country...but as a matter of proportion, blacks are more likely to be poor.

Every time someone points out that there are many blacks making poor choices, there are one of two ideas thrown out there

1) The person saying that is racist (or, if the person happens to be black, they're called an "Uncle Tom") and

2) It's not their fault...America is institutionally racist.

There are plenty of people from all ethnicities and races that don't make the best choices....but more often than not, blacks are singled out because of the statistics behind it. You can debate the reasons why, but the unwed mother, incarceration, and poverty rates are disproportionately higher in blacks.

Cosby's argument is that things can be done about this, but it does not involve more entitlements or other government intervention...but rather that blacks should take control of their own life and choose to do well in life.

It's good advice for people of all races and backgrounds. If you work hard in this country, you will reap enormous benefits.

[David Gardner]

Quoting from the article by Marc Lamont Hill, Assistant Professor of Urban Education at Temple University:

During a recent speech at the commencement ceremony at the historically black Spelman College in Atlanta, Mr. Cosby further demonized black men by labeling them as people who "send their sperm" but run from being fathers. In a recent CNN interview, Mr. Cosby criticized black men who would rather "sell drugs than flip burgers."

Bill Cosby is not "deamonizing black men by labeling them." He is merely pointing out the truth. To be fair, it is a truth that extends across races, cultures and nationalities. It cannot be denied however, that the problem exists disporportionatly in the black community.

Mr. Hill goes on to crticize Cosby for "not being sufficiently nuanced." In other words, he's insensitive, intolerant and guilty of the worst sin one can commit in today's PC world - offensive.

No matter how you analyze it, it still comes down to people and the choices they make in life.

[Chris Thorman]

Cosby's comments are a breath of fresh air. And I do think that poverty has more to do with crime stats that race.

[G]

As a black man, it is not surprising, nor should it be offensive to anyone, that Mr. Cosby would be directing his criticisms at fellow african americans.

As for what actually saying, he's dead on accurate. People need to just forget the racial aspects of it. Everything he says pertaining to black people, pertains equally to white people.

It's the same message, and it's a great one if people would just quit being such PC morons and just listen to it: take responsibility for your life and your family.

That simple idea should be colorless.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

I do some volunteer work in the inner city here and it is very disheartening to see how many of these young boys are being raised with no male role model around them.

This is the problem! Boys need a strong male figure in their lives. This role model will help with choices that are made down the road. Everything from school, to hanging out with the wrong crowd. Not saying people with male role models in their lives always make the correct decision, but they the opportunity to learn how to stnad up and be a man in the decision making process and more importantly how to recover from a bad decision.

I want to encourage the people on this thread(not blog) to get involved! There are so many chances like Big Brothers and Sisters, Boys and girls clubs and the best www.hopecenterkc.org

Get off your butts and make the difference in a childs life!

[christina]

Young white men get into just as much trouble as young black men. The ONLY reason this country still has racism....Parents are still teaching it. Every person is genetically made the same way. The ONLY difference is or skin color. That should not matter. I am white and when i brought home my Ex-Boyfriend(who is black) my mom cried. Yet she didnt teach us to see color she still couldnt handle it. She now Loves him. The only way to change how people feel about different races it to teach our youth the right way.

[christina]

Boys dont always need a stong male role model. The just need the right role model whether male or female.

[t-bone]

i agree. cosbys comments should apply to everyone. im tired of white, black, mexican, or whatever complaining about their situation. my parents were poor and they worked hard for us and themselves and now they have a better life. also there is a direct link to fatherless homes and poverty and crime. if all people would take responsiblity for themselves, work hard, quit having multiple babies by multiple men, men taking responsibility for babies they father, things would change.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

Nope! Boys (studies have shown) need a strong Male role model. No PC BS here. Females do not understand what a male is going through and can not help him in the same way as another Male.

Sorry to burst the feminist bubble. Young men need a strong Male role model.(somewhere in their life, the closer the better)

[lr]

My parents had nothing when they got married and had two kids immediately and had the extra responsibility of caring for two of my mom's sisters. Yet, they taught us all right--to not accept handouts, and to take personal responsibility. Hard work helped them greatly in later years and this mindset was imparted to the three of us (my siblings and I). As a result we are all living responsibly. So much boils down to personal responsibility. Goes to show not everyone who grew up poor initially has to live their whole life in that situation.

[christina]

Well lets see there are pastors, coaches, Boyscout leaders....people of this nature that can be there to talk with a boy if needed. Not all boys who grow up with just moms turn out to be bad.

[christina]

I have studied nursing and people for years thats what i do, i would like to see the study as to which you are refering to.

[t-bone]

your right christina. not all of them do. but that usually because they had some sort of male influence and a mom that would whoop ass when they needed it.

[christina]

Thats all i was trying to get at t-bone thank you!

[t-bone]

the problem is we have a system that rewards people who stay at home and have more babies and dont want to work. while people who are working hard to just get by get nothing.

[Nolan Pinkney]

I respect Bill Cosby and his comments but where is the positive remarks in what he's saying.
Criticism is good at times however, there are black men that will work hard to handle their responsibilities because I'm one of them and I have two jobs!
About him talking about the poor, opportunities must be created for the poor to excel and live better lives.
It's a great thing to see a famous person care about our society especially our young people. Just don't place everyone in the same light because you see a few bad ones.
As long as this "divide and conquer" attitude exist in our society, there will always be conflict and issues within.

[t-bone]

he could be more positive, but it appears his message is not for people like you nolan but for those who are not handling their business.

[christina]

Some of our poor chose to reamain poor. The poor of ALL races. Those who want out, GET OUT of poverty. I know. I grew up in a "poor" family. Now i am working on being the CEO of a hospital. Sometimes one has to create their own opportunities.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

ius.uwinnipeg.ca/pdf/WIRA_Male_Reading_Teachers.pdf
www.nuatc.org/articles/pdf/cries_of_a_crisis.pdf
www.cato.org/testimony/ct-wc67.html
www.nova.edu/ssss/QR/QR6-4/wellswilbon.html
www.nysccc.org/T-Rarts/DispelMyths.html
www.terry.uga.edu/~dawndba/4500FailingBlkBoys.html
www.singlesexschools.org/advantages-forboys.htm

Christina,
If you do research then you should have known how and where to find this stuff. Have fun reading. The point here is Positive Male role models are what is needed! I saved you some serious time here.

[The Angry Conservative]

Chris Thorman:

"And I do think that poverty has more to do with crime stats that race."

Exactly....poverty drives crime. Furthermore, when speaking of adults, poverty is almost always self-driven.

Having children when you can't even provide for yourself is just flat-out stupid...but it happens a LOT. Same reason STD's are the problem that they are. You got a lot of absent-minded people having their "fun" while being stupid or careless while doing so...and the resulting children bear most of the suffering.

As for male influence....sorry ladies...men and women are different...biologically and emotionally. Period. If a boy is raised by a woman and does not have a male influence (can be a friend, an uncle...whatever), the kid may very well turn out OK...but as much as I hear about how men don't know jack about women's struggles, people that suggest vice versa really shouldn't be discounted so quickly. There are a lot of dynamics in the male "sphere" that woman just don't know about or won't "get"...or at the very least, won't instill in their children. That's not an insult...just a plain fact.

Men, as parents, are generally much more authoritative whereas women are much more emotional and perhaps less hard on their children. This can be taken too far. If you don't have a parent (whether it be man or woman) educating you on how harsh this world can be and how to best circumvent hardships in everyday life, it puts you behind the curve.

In situations where a one-parent situation is present, it really needs to be drilled into a child's head that the situation is not what the child should shoot for when they get that old. It should be stressed that graduation from high school (if not college) and marriage should both precede childbirth..and that it's a really bad idea to have kids before you're 20 unless you're in a very good environment.

Bernard Goldberg did an analysis of impoverished people (all races), and he discovered that if you follow three rules in life, you will be much less likely to be in poverty

1) Graduate high school
2) Get married BEFORE you have children
3) Don't have kids period until age 20 (married or not)

I can't remember the percentages...but it was substantial.

[jb]

Jason Whitlock's column was right on target!
It contained a common sense approach to the
problems in our inner-cities.

Christina, just like a girl needs a strong female role model growing up so does a boy need a strong male role model.

This is not discriminatory or derogatory.
It is just a fact of life.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

Preach it JB.

It is so very important to have a male role in the childs life.

This is not an ass whooping is about learning and growing into a man. And then growing other into men and the cycle then keeps going.

[christina]

I am not saying women can do a mans job when it coems to a child. I am just saying that their does not need to be a man in the home for the child to grow into a good man. As to the other subject that women are not the hard ones on children....well you need to ask MY daughters if i am hard or not. I have three girls and let me tell you they WILL NOT grow up with disrespect for me or anyother adult for that matter. I will not have them running the streets and calling me choice names. So i am handling my business now, while they are still young.

[lr]

I think there should be too, if there isn't one already, a program where employees from SRS speak to high school juniors and seniors about the reality of wrong decision making. These employees see desperation and bad mistakes on a daily basis and it wouldn't hurt to have kids hear how miserable a lifelong "caseload" type of existence is.

[Laura]

Jokie - No male role model is better than a bad male role model.

[lr]

If there is no immmediate good male role model, that is where a search needs to be made for good programs, mentors,etc who can provide a good male role model for the absence of one in the home. There are good male role models out there to be discovered.

[The Angry Conservative]

Christine:

I was not making a blanket statement about all women. I was stating what is generally the case. No generalization is true all of the time. Believe you me, there is no shortage of men that have no spine.

Uh... Whitlock's column wasn't a crime, right? So why is it listed under "Crime Scene KC"? For that matter, why does "Crime Scene KC" deserve the front page at all?

[J-sizzle]

Like Whitlock said, we've been hearing this from people like the wrath of Farakhan and Jesse Jackson for the last two decades, yet none of these guys present a plan. Perhaps the bigger problem with the black community in the last few years has been its 'all to willling to talk and do nothing leadership'.

Although I agree with Bill Cosby's sentiments (except for that weird comment about Harriet Tubman) the average person and large black middle class would like to know what they could do to help the situation.

my point is, shouldn't Cosby be drawing up a plan to sell pudding pops or fat albert memorbilla for the innercity or something instead of blasting poor blacks behind their backs at college graduations?

[ROBERT THE REV]

I'LL ADMIT BEFORE I READ ARTICLE; I SAID WHY IS WHITLOCK DOING AN ARTICLE ON COSBY ON SPORTS PAGE. BUT I'LL ADMIT IT NEEDED TAFTER I DIGESTED IT; I'LL ADMIT HE WAS RIGHT ON TARGET. AMERICA HAS TO STOP HIDING BEHIND A LIE AND FACE THE TRUTH WHITE AND BLACK.WHY DOES TRUTH ALWAYS STIR UP CONTROVERSAY ?

[christina]

To whoever asked why this is on Crime KC...Greg told you the reson he put it here if you would read the above before you comment.

[Nett]

I do not have a problem with what Mr. Cosby has said in regards to the black community. If you are handling your business then what he has said does not apply to you. He is talking about the ones that constantly "blame the white man" for any and everything that goes wrong in their life. Most blacks don't even know that it was their very own ancestors that sold them into slavery.

I am a black woman raised by a single mother. My father has been in and out of jail for his entire life and he came from a two parent home but he made his choice.

I think that black teenagers are afraid to reach to teachers or counselors at their schools. They don't want to be thought of as weak or uncool. The thought process in the black community needs to be changed.

Here in Kansas City the schools need to be revamped also. Putting teachers in an environment that they are not comfortable in tends to make them edgy and the students can pick up on that.

No one has mentioned the bible. Some of the churches around town are full of women. Prayer can be a strong force. A family that prays together stays together.

[Jason]

Why was the comment about Harriet Tubman weird to you J-sizzle?
Cosby is stepping up to the plate. Sounds like something Malcolm X might be saying if he was around!

[EWAT]

i'm a black middle-aged male and here's what i think. alot of blacks are down and stay down because there is a battle going on amongst blacks. that battle is for the hearts and minds of blacks. on one side you got the mentality that says going to school is for suckers, dropping out of school is cool. wanting to know street knowledge more than book knowledge is the way to be, proud of making money other than by legitimate work. being a pimp is a position to work towards. i can go on and on.
and on the other side you have decent everyday hard-working blacks who only want to do the right thing and live a comfortable life. the battle comes in because the people that want to hang on to that corrupt mentality want to pull all blacks over to their side in any way they can. And one way is by calling the decent black weak, stupid, soft, punk, acting white, or sellout. See chris rock’s stand up act called “bring on the pain.” He’s absolutely right.
it often happens when they are young. alot of blacks get pulled over to that side and end up in jail, dead, poor, broke and just messed up altogether. all the decent black is trying to do is steer their kids away from that mentality but some get sucked in and want to suck in as many more blacks as they can.
a book called "code of the streets" really explains it well.
And then you have the white people on the job who resist all they can to try to keep the black who is working along side them from advancing. They display racism, but they do it as subtly as they can to try not to draw any attention to themselves. You know who you are. You don’t want a black person over you, teaching you or being promoted before you. These people contribute to blacks problem too. Think about it

[BIGE]

Cosby is blasting young black men? Whats wrong with that? Its just all talk. Nobody has a plan. The only ones that say they have a plan are the polititions, and when they take office everyone soon knows there is no plan. The last most influential person to have a clue was King Jr. He didnt even have a plan, he had a dream. Yeah Cosby was right about what he said, Ouch!! it hurts a little to hear it come from him. But then again, when the next monthly check comes in, none of his targets will remember he was here.
Have a kid a yr will keep the job away..

[Bohica]

I think there is a real problem when people refer to themselves as "African-Americans", "Mexican-Armericans", etc... Excuse me??? Where were you born? Me? I am an AMERICAN!! I'm not a German-American, nor an English-American, or whatever. When we stop this (this space for rent)-American crap, maybe we can start growing as a country!

My daughters ask what nationality they are. I tell them: AMERICAN... PERIOD!!!

And I don't want to hear how whitey has it better. Like everyone else has said, it's about choices. I went to public schools. After graduation, I went into the Marines. I didn't have any scholarships (even though the Marines offered me one). nor mommy & daddy paying my way. It's about choices!

You want to follow someone else, then that is your problem. Most of my friends went into the Navy on a buddy program. I went into the Marines by myself. Don't march to someone else's drum. Get your own drum and march to your own beat!

[Bohica]

Here is an article by an preacher.

http://www.michaellwilliams.com/blog/display.php?id=421

[Shane]

I must say that I do not always agree with Jason Whitlock but his remarks and those of Bill Cosby are right on. My wife and I come from poor backgrounds and always were raised to believe that welfare is only a way to help in the short term, it was not meant to sustain a person or family.

The problem they discuss is not solely with young blacks it is with all Americans. Everyone has heard of "white trash". I think the majority of Americans are complacent and really need a kick in the pants. I have always believed that if you see a problem and do nothing about it you are contributing to the problem itself. People need to take more ownership for their actions (or inaction) and always strive to improve (mentally, socially, physically, and spiritually).

It is almost a daily occurrence how as Americans we are falling behind other countries in science, technology....why, because we are complacent. We want what we want without working for it.

How great would the country be if everyone gave 110% to improve. This is a land of opportunity, we just need to seize those opportunities when they arise. If we wanted state run services and handouts wouldn't we all want to be in a socialist government not democratic.

[Javier]

Right on Bohica...
now if I can just get the rest of America, (white americans, african americans, irish americans, etc)...to stop calling me Mexican American and list me as an American, we can get on with Living in America.
I come from a poor family, learned both English and Spanish, got an education, and now give back to the community. I am an American PERIOD. All that Ethnic crap needs to go out the window. We keep dividing ourselves, and our problems are not going to get addressed. They will get blamed on "them", "this" race, or "that" ethnicity...

[christina]

I dont think that we even need to go 110% if everyone JUST did at least his or her 100% we would be on our way to a better cournty. Something anyway.

[monty]

For those of us who value the welfare of ourselves and our family I would be interested in what hospital Christina hopes to be CEO of.

[christina]

Monty, what do you mean by that?

[Brian H.]

I agree with Cosby, and Whitlock. These men have the right idea. I would expand on it by saying that anyone who uses excuses to be lazy, black, white, red, yellow, purple, blue are all doing the same thing. Whatever segment of the population that is being "held down" at the moment is the "victim". This culture of victimology is getting really old.

I find it funny that there are those on this blog who say how much they agree, then turn around and say it is because of statistics. Isn't that a little contradictory?

[lr]

Christina, I dont think Monty's comment was meant to be exceedingly complimentary. :)

[christina]

I think that i understand that, but before i commented i wanted to be sure.

[christina]

Besides i know that i will be great someday. Why, I am working my butt off to acheive my goals, so dont hate me(monty) Because my goals are bigger than yours.

[Brian H.]

I missed a couple of comments that were a bit contradictory also. j-sizzle said "shouldn't Cosby be drawing up a plan to sell pudding pops or fat albert memorbilla for the innercity or something instead of blasting poor blacks behind their backs at college graduations?"

I think that to say something like this misses the whole point of taking responsibility for your own actions. Cosby came up with a plan. His plan is not blame others for your problems and do something about it, don't wait on someone to hold your hand because it isn't going to happen.

[MICHAEL OATES]

I have copied an article by leonard pitts of the miami herald, who talk about "white men" like bill cosby and Jason whitlock it follows:
IN MY OPINION
Whites should acknowledge failings, tooBY LEONARD PITTS JR.
lpitts@MiamiHerald.com
Thank you, but I don't need a lecture on personal responsibility.

Many of you apparently felt otherwise after reading my recent column on the use of the justice system as a cudgel against black children.

The column dealt with the mistreatment of over 100 juveniles, most of them African American, who were left in a flooded New Orleans detention center for up to five days without food and water after Hurricane Katrina. It was also about the death of Martin Lee Anderson, an unresisting 14-year-old black kid who was hit, choked and restrained by up to nine guards in a Panama City ``boot camp.''

The abuse and the disproportionate number of black kids who wind up in those places was, I said, a legacy of the nation's historic tendency to use its justice system to control a population it finds frightening and inconvenient.

ISSUE OF RESPONSIBILITY

In response, a woman named Charlene demanded to know, ''When is the black community going to take responsibility for themselves?'' An individual named Don wrote, ''Why are they in jail? Because most young blacks are thugs, dope dealers and car thieves in my experience.'' A fellow named Jay wrote that, ''AA women need to stop having children out of wedlock. . . . Raise a child in a home with a mother and father and you will see the stats for crime go way down.'' Some people, using statistics freshly pulled from their backsides, sought to ''prove'' black kids commit pretty much all of the crime in the country.

And one individual said Martin Lee Anderson's guards ``did us all a favor.''

As I said, some people find the existence of black children inconvenient.

You want to talk responsibility? I'm fine with that. Much of what ails African America lies squarely within its power to fix; I've been saying that in this space for many years.

But the fact is, the need for greater personal responsibility, important as it is, does not of itself account for all the dysfunctions that beset the African-American community.

LOOKING PAST RACISM

Of course, many white folks don't want to go there. And it never fails to amaze me how they absolve themselves and this nation of the charge of racism, how readily they look past, look through, flat-out ignore, anything that says otherwise. Indeed, it's telling that of all the dissenters preaching personal responsibility, not a single one refuted or even addressed the statistics in the column suggesting that racial animus plays a role in the disproportionate number of black people behind bars.

I repeat: And Justice For Some, a 2000 study co-sponsored by the Justice Department, found that a black drug defendant is 48 times more likely to be jailed than a white one with the same record.

There's more. According to The Real War on Crime: The Report of the National Criminal Justice Commission, blacks account for 13 percent of all regular drug users but 35 percent of those arrested, 55 percent of those convicted and 74 percent of those imprisoned for drug possession. A 2004 Miami Herald report found that a judicial procedure that allows a defendant's record to be wiped clean of a felony offense is given freely to white drug dealers, rapists and child molesters. But to blacks? Not so much. And this remains true, even when adjusted for socioeconomic factors.

Beg pardon, but ''personal responsibility'' does not explain those disparities. And it's vexing that so many Caucasians find it so hard to get their lips around the word that does.

WAGGING THE FINGER

But then, that would require of them more than the easy ability to wag a finger at the failures of others. It would require a willingness to own their own failures and to face truths that do not flatter self-image -- something some white Americans clearly lack the intestinal fortitude to do. So you'll forgive me if I find it hard to take seriously all this pious advice to African Americans.

Responsibility is a two-way street.

[openmind]

I agree, it is easy for people to go out and preach "personal responsibility" because it absolves them of their own responsibility. The fact is racism still exists whether you like it or not. With the way America is set up currently, even those minorities with "personal responsibility" face an uphill battle. Where is all of this outrage at the Justice system for being unfair? Why don't some white people accept their "personal responsibility" to get out and combat racism? To think that all of the blame for the current situation of blacks lies squarely on their shoulders is just as ignorant as their belief that it all lies squarely on white shoulders. Both sides contribute to the problem and both need to make changes.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

Christina,

No attacks but you never mentioned which hospital? (is there one)?

On to more important things. What is a plan to show these youths that there is more to life than living ghettofabulous(quoting cosby). What are your ideas?

[The Angry Conservative]

"There's more. According to The Real War on Crime: The Report of the National Criminal Justice Commission, blacks account for 13 percent of all regular drug users but 35 percent of those arrested, 55 percent of those convicted and 74 percent of those imprisoned for drug possession"

Want an explanation for that? Because there are more cops necssary (per capita) in KCMO and KCK, for example, than Lenexa and Overland Park. Drug use may transcend all economic layers, but crime brought on by poverty does not.

Secondly, if you are legitimately guilty, I really don't care at all what race you are.

[openmind]

That might explain the higher arrest rate, but it doesn’t explain the higher conviction rate or the higher imprisonment rate.

[monty]

The only whites keeping blacks down are the liberal parasites blacks continue to vote for. Wake up and realize Uncle Teddy ,Aunt Hillary etc... are the only people with a vested interest in minority failure.

[christina]

I said that was working towards that goal. No not yet there is not a specific hospital.

[Luan]

I wonder if whites would prefer an Asian boss or a black boss.

[christina]

Who cares what color your boss is they are still your boss!

[Maxine]

I am a black woman with three children, two in college and one still in high school. I was 18 when I gave birth to my first child and I was label just as many black teens are today, the sad thang about that is I and the teens today was and are label more by our own than any other race.
I have told my children that we have been molded to be our own worst enemy, the beatings and the hangings my have stop but they have already acheived their goal. White people no longer have to put us down and tell us we are the weaker race, everytime we lump our children in this hopeless group we continue their legacy for them. I am not who you think I am, I have the ability to change and time has done just that.
I decided long ago that I was going to stop listening to the negativity of my people, who did not like MY choices and judge me accordingly, now I teach my children to do the same. Not everyone will like your choices, yes you will be judge for them and some might lump you into this group and say that's who you are without stopping to get to know you.
Do I believe Mr. Cosby made judgement of the whole by the group that he has seen, yes I do but that is for him to do but I will not let it define me or my choice to raise my children the way I see fit.

[plattecohighschooler]

Man, I'm white, and I would take Cosby over any rock star as a roll model almost any day. I don't see why my African- American counterparts don't take him over some rapper who rhymes about knockin up hoes.

[Maxine]

That's because he is saying what you want to say but can't. Not everyone is going to feel the same about a person or a situation, so do that make them a bad person for it.

[EWAT]

WHEN IT COMES TO DEMOCRAT VS. REPUBLICANS, DEMS ARE FOR THE WORKING MAN ie,,UNIONS AND REPUBS ARE STRICTLY FOR BIG BUSINESS ie..HALLIBURTON. WHICH SIDE ARE YOU ON? IT REALLY HAS NO PLACE IN THE DISCUSSION. BUT SINCE IT WAS MENTIONED ON AN EARLIER POST I JUST THREW THIS IN

[plattecohighschooler]

EWAT, that's absolutely untrue. Come on. Whitewater? Does that ring a bell? And you must remember that all those Republican- initiated tax breaks for buisnesses that help them hire new workers and turn them into unionized "working men." So all in all, the Republicans are helping the common man by freeing up money for coporations so that they can give the common man work. SO DON'T BE GIVING US THE "BIG BUISINESS FAT CATS AND THEIR REPUBLICAN FRIENDS IN GOVERNMENT" CRAP!!!!!!!!!!

[EWAT]

hey angry white man..er' i mean conserative. you forgot to mention how all the whites who are let off for the same crimes as blacks might have a little to with how your stats are slanted.

[plattecohighschooler]

All in all, I think that Cosby is completely justified in his campaign and that Whitlock was justified in writing the article. Cosby is spreading a message of empowerment not unlike the one that feminists (no matter how absurd some of their messages may be) used to free women from subservient treatment. Why shouldn't blacks be empowered as well? Whitlock is someone who has worked to get his position and has made few excuses for what he has done, which is what Cosby advocates and that means that he can write about it. End of story, kiddies.

[monty]

Christina, my comments were rude and uncalled for. I overeacted to your notion that a boy doesnt need aman in the house to be a good man. I agree anything is possible but if the boy knows the father is out there and couldnt care less it can be very difficult and society often feels the wrath of his or her frustrations. First off,I love women,was married and I have adaughter but there is a feminist dogma that stresses men arent necessary and this should not be encouraged regarding kids. Good luck in your quest,I worked in nursing home administration at one time so we are kindreds. Iwill play nicer next time.

[plattecohighschooler]

Yeah. That thing about men not being needed is crap. We aren't all sexist pigs, and we all know that women have absolutely no idea of how much power they have over us. Ask any married man. He could be doing something else. Maybe leading a more adventurous life, but he gave it up for her. The old saying about the wife taking over where the mother leaves off is true. My mom orders my dad around like a drill sargent. Most men think of it as in their best interests to treat women with respect.

[Ron Davis]

Here is my take on this issue.Mr Cosby is telling the truth.He went through 3 things that let me know that he has a backbone and someone beside him that is his equal.He was accused of an affair(with a white chick),he was a victim of extortion from I believe the child of the affair,, and he lost his son to an ignorant bastard .This man is rich and can go ahead to Europe or elsewhere like alot of black entertainers.But he's here and he is putting his mouth where where his money is.Wake up everybody!!

[Nicki]

I am/was a single mom due to an abusive spouse. I never wanted to be divorced and poor, but I did not want to die or have my children beaten or be around beatings. I was strong as nails, but my son needed a strong, consistent male role model. It did not happen and he suffered. His maturity was delayed until he could in essence father himself. I tried to be both mother and father and just could not give enough. By trying to be both, I failed as a mother as well. We are all passed it, but Cosby is right. I am Caucasian and have 2 degrees. Sometimes being beaten down and having to rise regardless is indeed colorless. Blame never helped me or my son solve anything.

[monty]

Nicki, The most powerful comments of the day. P.S. where have you been all my life.

[MICHAEL OATES]

here is another news report:

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. -- Black motorists in Missouri continue to be pulled over by police at a higher rate than white and Hispanic drivers, according to an analysis of more than 1.5 million traffic stops made last year.

The annual report released Thursday by Attorney General Jay Nixon shows black drivers were 46 percent more likely to be stopped than either white or Hispanic drivers. The disparity has widened since 2004, when blacks were 38 percent more likely than whites to be stopped.

Although Hispanic motorists were stopped at the same rate as white drivers last year -- an improvement from a slight disparity the previous year -- they were 98 percent more likely to be searched than white drivers.

Black motorists who were stopped were 78 percent more likely to be searched than whites - up from 71 percent in 2004.

Nixon, who is required by law to compile traffic-stop data from Missouri's law enforcement agencies, said the statistical disproportion does not prove law officers are stopping minority drivers because of their race.

But he added: "Missouri law enforcement should continue their constructive efforts to eliminate any perceptions that traffic stops are being made solely on the basis of race, rather than for legitimate reasons."

Nixon said almost the exact same thing in a prepared statement after last year's report.

The regional leader of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People said the report's figures are disturbing. He pointed particularly to the fact that black drivers were stopped and searched at a higher rate than whites, yet contraband was found on black drivers at a lower rate -- in 18.6 percent of searches compared to 23.6 of searches for whites.

Black motorists "are being humiliated by the law. They are being subjected to searches when clearly whatever predisposition the officer had when they stopped them is not being validated by the hard evidence of the stop," said the Rev. Gill Ford, of St. Louis, director of a 10-state region for the NAACP.

"The numbers basically reflect that there is a problem," Ford added. "The unfortunate piece is that Missouri has a law that causes them to collect the data, and the dilemma is they don't do anything once they collect it - everybody makes excuses."

The statewide total of more than 1.5 million traffic stops in 2005 was up from 1.37 million the previous year, an increase of about 10 percent. Nixon said part of that may be attributable to a change in law that took effect in August 2004 requiring the reporting of a wider variety of stops.

This year's report used 2005 census estimates compiled by Geolytics Inc. Previous reports used population figures from the 2000 census.

[EWAT]

HEY PLATTECO, no matter how you try to spin it republicans hate unions and are stictly for management not the average worker.

[monty]

With all due respect,if the unions would throw their votes to the GOP ,I doubt you would see very little hate from them. Could it be that alittle IF YOU CANT BEATEM JOINEM would be in order.

[ewat]

how many white people on here hate to have a black boss? c'mon be honest. dont it just burn you up to have a black telling you what to do? these are the things whites need to take respnsibility for. you need to look at yourself in this area and work on trying to rid yorself of that cause it contributes to the problem.

[plattecohighschooler]

Absolutely not, I do what I'm told. I had a black teacher last year, and though he was black and about 6'5", I obeyed him. Now quit making racially beligerant comments and focus on the issue, noob.

[plattecohighschooler]

Anyways, what's that got to do with Jason Whitlock's column.

[plattecohighschooler]

And, oh yeah, WE'LL BEAT 'EM.

[*****]

I think it's an attitude or mindset problem that spans across all races and cultures.

My mom and dad's families were poor, but they didn't commit crimes. I don't remember any of them saying anything unkind about another person no matter what their genetic expression or how much money they appeared to have.

[Reminder - EWAT]

thank you platteco, thank you for being honest. my message is to those who are not. i'm simply pointing out things that are wrong in both races.
blacks have things they need to take responsibility for and so do whites. my point is this, one of the things whiteslike to say is "why don't they get a job," when talking about certain black people. but when they do get a job theyre met with all kind of racism and resistance on that job, like whites not wanting you to learn a certain job which the white must teach the black. these attitudes contribute to the quote unquote black problem.

[John Boy]

Too bad you didnt sign your post

[J-Sizzle]

To the comments about my previous post:

I just think its weird to compare modern poverty to slavery. To me its not the same formula and I have never heard of Harriet Tubman freeing slaves at gunpoint. I'm pretty sure it did not take that much convincing.

And the diffrence between somebody like Bill Cosby and Malcolm X is, people like King and Malcolm X not only talked the talk, but also headed massive organizations that put peopele to work or got them involved in the political system. Bill Cosby like all suppoused leaders since the 1960's (think Al Sharpton) just uses his platform (in my opinion) to kick people when they are down.

I'm not saying he's not right about some things, but crime and poverty in the inner city aren't exactly new phenomena. Bill Cosby making speeches is not going to fix the kc school distric per se. Bill Cosby using his wealth to put poor kids into college or creating jobs like Magic Johnson, is a better idea.

[Nicki]

Monty, thanks for the compliment. I guess I have been working two/three jobs to get two kids through college and pay for one wedding. It was worth it though!

[oldrnsin]

This letter was posted in the Star's letters to the editors a few weeks ago:
"When I read Gertrude Brandy’s letter (5/8), I paused and read it again. Yes, she did indeed write, We, or our ancestors, have all been immigrants, except our native American Indians.

I am black. My ancestors came over here to this country as slaves, chained in the holds of ships. Many died. I felt compelled to enlighten Ms. Brandy.

We black people are still in the process of trying to obtain full citizenship in America."

The Star wouldn't print my response to this letter. The last sentence says it all about this woman's attitude. And that's what Cosby was talking about. Blacks have the same rights of citizenship as any other American.

The quickest way to alienate whites is to whine about a nonexistent inequality and try to lay a guilt trip about slavery.

[ewat]

hey J-Sizzle you can't change what you don't acknowledge. bill cosby is just the messenger. don't hate the messenger.
and this statment:
"I'm not saying he's not right about some things."
what are the things he's right about? let's have a discussion about the things he's right about then.
bill cosby doesnt have to spend his money sending black folk to college just to prove something to you. all he's responsible for his own family. get up off your azz and send yourself and your family to college. if bill spent all his money on black folk they would call him stupid and laugh at him behind his back. that's just how ignorant some black folk are.

[Mario]

So many great points and comments here. I'd like to add from personal experience that while i grew up in a terribly poor family and community. In a third world country with no welfare system, no government help and a proportionately higher crime rate. I also had a young father that did nothing, never around and a mother that made poor choices, had too many (8)children and no college or high school degree. My path was destined to become a statistic, a youth who would have no degree, many kids i can't support and either sell drugs or commit crimes. If you told anyone i'd have 3 degrees, be working on an MBA, coaching kids soccer in the community, have a wife and children in a very nice house, they would laugh you to scorn. But i have this, and i'm considered a role model by many kids.

How? Deep down inside every one has that desire to be somebody and achieve success. You just need people in the community to bring that desire out. The youths i grew up with had that desire. The only difference is that they only saw limited ways to success. Become a rap artist, sell drugs or play soccer. The older you become the more you understand that statistically in that community it was very far fetched. But I was lucky to be surrounded by positive male role models and i was a very skilled athlete. I was able to use this skill and the motivation to succeed like my role models to become successful.

Bill Cosby is right. You can't better yourself if you "accept" the destiny society or the media or statistics put on you. No matter what race you are from. However, we cannot deny that it is tougher for minorities. Its not just poverty. Its poverty and the way society handles it. Some of us need to spend some time with these youths before commenting. Some of us say we were poor, but c'mon now. Were you really truly poor? I've done a little of this and boy, you have some kids that may have been brainwashed, given up or something. But they have that strong conviction that their life is destined to doom, unless they become a rap star, push drugs or through sports. Bill Cosby's message seem's like a motivational tool to me. He may not be spending money but at least he's saying something that i'm sure at least one poor soul might use to empower himself/herself to at least try. I don't see why people are criticizing him for this. As opposed to the artist telling them how many grams they pushed to make it out of the ghetto. As opposed to the media for glamorizing athletes and celebrities as if this is going to help many kids out of the slum. As opposed to the system that hands out a welfare check and spends less on education, less on teachers and job creation efforts. As opposed to parents who've given up on trying to teach and push their children to try to achieve success. As opposed to US, who sit down and post articles and spread our views, thinking that this is going to solve the problem.

Thank you Bill for your effort.

[christina]

We are ALL americans. Color of skin in my eyes should NEVER be a factor.

[christina]

People have to be willing to work their way out of poor situations. I am a single mother of three. I was married, he was abusive. Even now that we are divorced i still have to deal with him. I am currently working on my Bachelors degree so i am going to college full time. I work a full time job. I am a soldier in the Army. I get one day off a month. IT CAN BE DONE.

[Maxine]

Here we go another black man putting us down. Ewat you are right, Mr. Cosby should not spend his money sending anyones children to school. Why sit your big azz watching tv, listening to other millionairs thinking I care about what you think.

This is not the 50's, 60's or 70's, the times has changed and the inner cities are not like they were when Mr. Cosby was young, how many times have he came face to face with the teenagers today, how many times have he walked into battered women shalter and how many times have he walked into the intensive care unit of a children's hospital. All of these things play apart to the mindset of a child that had to endure them.

When Mr. Cosby show me that he has accomplished these things, then and only then I will listen. I deal with teenagers that have been abandon by there parents, ranaway for the abuse at home to be abused in the streets. Do you not believe all of these things play a part in the state of mind of an adult who's life was surround by such torment, if you can not find some kind of support system in this world you become what so many adults become, a drug addict, alcholic or a long term prisoner.

You want to get my attention; tell me of the things you have seen and the people you have spoke too, and I am not talking about people with money but those who are living the every day grind.

[christina]

MAxine, I honor what you do! I recently was deployed to Bosnia, the children there go through similar things here. However they do not have people like you to be there for them. I met two 8 yr old boys that lost their parents. They luive in old abondoned houses and eat out of trash cans. They do what they do what they ahve to do to survive. A pencil to a bosnian child is like recieving gold. You give a pencil to an american child as a gift and they will look at you like you are stupid. I am glad there are people like you MAxine That care about our youth enough to help them.

[The Angry Conservative]

openmind:

OK...where here's a few more things that I can pose to you. Those figures suggest that blacks comprise 13 percent of all drug arrests...blacks comprise 10-15 percent of the population. I'm sorry, I don't think that's accurate. The idea that drug-using blacks comprise a proportionate amount of drug-users (and how exactly did they measure that, I'm curious) but comprise that much of a portion of the convictions and jailed men/women is a bit of a stretch.

It also doesn't account for people that are arrested more than once nor does it break it down by the drug of choice. I'm willing to bet that most white people caught with drugs have weed....which carries a pretty minor consequence unless you have a ton of it. Crack and heroin on the other hand will get you sent to jail every damn time. I don't know the "drug of choice" broken down by race, but I would assume that hard drug use (meth, heroin, crack, etc.) is more pervasive amongst the poor...which disproportionately affects blacks....which again makes me question the 13 percent figure.

Ewat:

First of all, you do not know what race I am.

Second of all, a boss is a boss....either they're competent or not. I have had minority bosses and I have had women bosses. My assessment of them does not at all focus on their demographics (unless they make it an issue themselves)...as is the case with most people.

Here's a question for you. I presume you're black based on what you've been saying. You have a problem with a white boss? If you do....and the race is why you have a problem...who's the bigot now?

I'm a "working man" and I'm not unionized...and I will never vote Democrat if it means voting for a left-winger. The unions are bankrupting GM, Ford, and a good share of the airlines. Pushes are on to unionize Wal-Mart and Starbucks.

I guess I just have pose question...if you don't like a job, how come you just get off your rump and find a better one? I used to work for Wal-Mart...hated it...so I worked hard and when I was able to, I moved on to something better (YEARS ago)

Like it or not, but market is supposed to determine labor rate...not some money-hungry extortionist union that completely ignores the fact that businesses are in business to make money...not be a self-contained social safety net. I won't argue that places like Wal-Mart aren't exactly the best place to work, but to expect them to start you at 12 bucks an hour and give you great insurance when they employ 1.2 million people domestically is a bit stupid, don't you think?

Never mind the fact that Democrats have no interest in people "moving up" the class ladder of life. If there weren't "lower class" Americans, they wouldn't have anyone to vote for them. Why exactly do you think that bloated idiot Teddy Kennedy is parroting the whole immigrant "rights" platform? He's PANDERING!

J-Sizzle:

Al Sharpton/Jesse Jackson are NOTHING like Bill Cosby. Sharpton and Jackson are in the business of making blacks feeling like victims at all times and they try to portray the idea that we still in the 60's. Cosby is urging people to stop blaming others for what they can largely control themselves. Democrats (for the most part) want you to be dependent on the government and have no issue in labeling you as "heartless" if you point out that people in fact do have the ability to make what they want out of life.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

I think we could all give what I have witnessed testimonies, but the question has not addressed:

WHAT CAN WE DO? HOW CAN WE HELP?

Deal with this and lets figure something out.

Maxine, I have done these things too, but I know I wanted better for my family than what I had, so I went to school and worked and will never stop trying to help inner city kids

[Maxine]

The teenagers today are not blaming anyone for who they are today. To them it is all about getting what you can while you can, the sad thang about that is if they have to die to get it than okay. These children don't care about white, black, green or purple, to them its all about the money.

This is the United States of America and all they hear is if you don't have it then you are nothing, this really tells me that so many of our adults are still stuck in their youth. When are we going to shut our mouths and listen to the children, their concerns for today are not your worries of yesterday.

[Maxine]

Jokie,

I commend you for that; like I said I am a mother of three, I gave birth to my first when I was 18. I have two daughters in UMC and my son is a junior in high School, so I know about fighting to make it but I contribute my success to my children and wanting to give them the life I was denied.

I was abandoned at 14 and the streets was not my friend, my faith and strength was what brought me through but there are so many who are not that fortunate. I have seen so much it is scary, young girls rap and killed, running scared because I did not know if I was next. I was not concerned of who wronged me all I knew I had to survive and blaming people was not going to do that for me.

[E.P.]

Racist, Racist, Racist. That is all you here out of African Americans anymore. The truth of the matter is, Blacks are more racists against whites. Bill Cosby tells the truth, and the African American community doesn't want to here the truth, THE TRUTH HURTS. As a white person that grew up in poverty, I did not resort to drugs, alcohol, robbery, murder, etc. I had two jobs for fifteen years. I went to East High School and remember honky day, being jumped and beaten by (always more than one) African American. Reverse these and their would be racial tentions, who knows Al Sharpton and Jesse may show up. Remember the forty or so blacks that beat that white man to DEATH at 10th and Paseo in the 1990's, NO murder charges by Claire McCaskill, only simple assult. Now reverse that, 40 whites kill an old black man and watch on your TV sets the African American Communities around the country. GET MY POINT YET, or do I need to continue. Bill Cosby should be nominated for the Peace Prize Award. Shut your big trap and listen to what he is saying.

[openmind]

Angry Conservative,
Way to follow the party lines and ignore factual evidence. I find evidence to support what I say, you tell me what you "feel." Once again, its the same ideals that led us into a war. The below information came from your beloved white house.

"Those figures suggest that blacks comprise 13 percent of all drug arrests...blacks comprise 10-15 percent of the population. I'm sorry, I don't think that's accurate"

http://www.whitehousedrugpolicy.gov/drugfact/minorities/index.html

Arrests & Sentencing

There were a total of 1,745,712 state and local arrests for drug abuse violations in the United States during 2004. Of the 1,745,712 drug abuse violations with race information available, 65.8% of those arrested were white, 32.9% were black, 0.7% were Asian or Pacific Islander, and 0.6% were American Indian or Alaskan Native.8

Of the individuals convicted of felony drug offenses in State courts during 2000, 53% were black and 46% were white. One percent of the offenders were of another race.10

During 2001, there were a total of 1,208,700 sentenced State prison inmates, 246,100 of whom were incarcerated for drug offenses. The majority of drug offenders held in State prisons were black (139,700), followed by whites (57,300), and Hispanics (47,000).11

"An estimated 971 thousand Americans used crack cocaine in 1998. Of those, 462 thousand were White, 324 thousand were Black, and 157 thousand were Hispanic.

Source: Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration, US Department of Health and Human Services, National Household Survey on Drug Abuse: Population Estimates 1998 (Washington DC: US Department of Health and Human Services, 1999), pp. 37-39.

But you may say that blacks are more likely to sell drugs right?

"On average over the three year period, blacks were 16 percent of admitted sellers and whites were 82 percent. According to research on patterns of drug purchase and use in selected major cities, drug users reported that their main drug sources were sellers of the same racial or ethnic background as they were"-

86 K. Jack Riley, Crack, Powder Cocaine, and Heroin: Drug Purchase and Use Patterns in Six U.S. Cities, Washington D.C.: National Institute of Justice and the Office of National Drug Control Policy, December 1997.

[openmind]

The fact is that even if there were a higher proportion of blacks that did use drugs, that proportion could never be high enough to account for the disparity in the conviction rates and in the prison population.

You suggest that the type of drug used could account for the disparity. While the link I provided demonstrated that drug use is consistent across categories, lets, for the sake of argument assume you are right.

Blacks use crack more and whites use cocaine and meth more. Knowing people who have been used and been addicted to both (I actually get out there like Maxine suggests and interact with people you would never go near) I would say that all three of those drugs are equally devastating. Yet why is the sentencing for crack so disproportionate to the rest?

"The mean average sentence length for powder cocaine is 77 months, compared to 119.5 months for crack cocaine. The median average is 60 months for powder cocaine and 97 months for crack cocaine". 2000 Sourcebook of Federal Sentencing Statistics, U.S. Sentencing Commission.

The average sentence for crack cocaine (ten years) is thirty-five percent longer than the average methamphetamine sentence and fifty-two percent longer than the average powder cocaine sentence. United States Sentencing Commission, 1999 Sourcebook of Federal Sentencing Statistics 69

The average crack cocaine sentence, 120 months, is greater than: the 103-month average sentence for robbery; the 76-month average sentence for arson; the 64-month average sentence for sexual abuse; and the 31-month average sentence for manslaughter. United States Sentencing Commission, 1999 Sourcebook of Federal Sentencing Statistics.

That in and of itself is racist. Now please dont tell me that there is still racism alive and well today, and dont wonder why so many black youths dont trust the justice system. Even if they arent doing anything illegal, they see the injustice going on. I get tired of white males (which I am) being the first in line to say quit complaining about discrimination when they have no idea at all what is goign on. You can "feel" whatever you want, I will continue to "prove" the truth.

Also, Maxine, I think I know you.

[ewat]

hey angry man said:

"Here's a question for you. I presume you're black based on what you've been saying. You have a problem with a white boss? If you do....and the race is why you have a problem...who's the bigot now?"

yeah i'm a black male i said so earlier.
anyway, you asked me a question and then went on to damn-near answer for me. don't do that man !!!
no, i don't have a problem with any boss black or white. i have a problem with white people on the job who resist any way they can to help a black person advance in the job ie..reluctantly and half-way train them, get an attitude when you go to them with a question yet they're the ones you are supposed to go to for the help, and try to get the black in trouble when the black has not done anything wrong. these people contribute to black's problem but say theyre not racist. they'll do the subtlest hateful thing while trying to not bring any attention to themselves. is this you angry man?

and EP. you're right. alot of blacks do cry racist over every little thing. but some white people are racist and try to hide it by throwing the rock and hiding their hand as mentioned above.
and yes some blacks are more racist against whites thats true. those people got a problem too. i call things as i see them no matter what your race is.

[Trish Hayes]

Three cheers for Jason Whitlock, and 4 cheers for Bill Cosby! Granted, some people are born into this world with more advantages than others, and that is just a fact. Mr Cosby is just reminding us that each person is also born with a free will, and how we choose to exercise that free will may affect more people than we will ever know. Bill Cosby's message applies to all people, black, white or Green. Thank you Mr. Cosby for taking a controversial stand, you are much admired by all races.

[ewat]

maxine said:
"You want to get my attention; tell me of the things you have seen and the people you have spoke too, and I am not talking about people with money but those who are living the every day grind."

i dont want to get your attention. but i will say this, the people i've seen and spoke to are my own kids and my family thats who. we are the ones "living the every day grind." like i said earlier there's a battle going on amongst blacks the battle is between niggas and black people. niggas want to get over, be slick, become a pimp, rob, steal, murder and pull as many black people over to their side as they can. a nigga hates a black person more than he hates anything else. because the black represents the very opposite thing the nigga stands for. go watch chris rock "bring on the pain." he said it in there and everybody laughed. well, why you not laughing when bill cosby says the same thing?

[christina]

Chris Rock was on a comedy stage. There for anything said is meant to be joke. Bill Cosby is being serious about his comments. I am not saying either is right or wrong, just saying background and place often determines how what you say is going to be percieved.

[Reminder - EWAT]

christina wrote:

"I am not saying either is right or wrong and Bill Cosby is being serious about his comments."

dont hesitate to say who's right or wrong go ahead and say it. tell me, who's right and who's wrong?
bill cosby should be serious because that corrupt mentality aint nothing to laugh about.
they are both saying the same thing. chris rock was serious too. you can try to deny it all you want. the truth is the truth regardless of who's saying it.

(Hi Ewat: In the future, please remember to sign your comments. Thanks, Greg Reeves)

[christina]

I just said that your surroundings come into play when you are tryignt o convey a message. DUH!

[The Angry Conservative]

Openmind:

So you think that a drug that a sentencing guideline that happens to disproportionately affect blacks is "racist"? You honestly think that a legislature said "you know what? Blacks use crack more than whites, so let's make the penalty stiff for crack and less so for meth.)

Pretty bold accusation, eh?

[openmind]

Something can be racist in effect even if not in intent.

[The Angry Conservative]

Christina:

All good humor has an element of truth. That is why Chris Rock is considered funny (by a lot of people, anyway)

[Maxine]

So ewat if you are so concerned about just yours, why are commenting at all about what someone else is doing. You are the one who likes to hold on to the blame game, white people have there problems too, children on drugs, murders, drug dealers, pimps and con-men but you don't see them putting their race down.

Why is it people like you can only pick out and comment on the bad. Can I ever read about you going out there and doing something for someone else except yourself, this is a hard world and I believe you have alot to offer some young lost person out there but all you can do is complain.

My thoughts and oppinions about Mr. Cosby (giving respect by not call him bill)are mine to have the my constitutional right.

[The Angry Conservative]

Openmind:

*shrugs*...well...there's a lot of crimes that blacks do more than whites due to povery rates they have. I guess your definition of racism differs from mine. Racism (as define by Webster) is "a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race"

By your logic, laws such as Sarbane-Oxley and other "white collar" legislation are racist against whites because they're usually the ones that get collared for that behavior.

I mean...I suppose you're one of those who thinks that requiring a photo ID to vote is discriminatory against minorities/poor people. Hell, I've heard that accusation lobbed even when the State has a standing policy to provide the ID free of charge.

I will grant you that the "hard drug" median sentences should at the very least be very close together, but absence of intent means it isn't racist, in my opinion. Could there be an inequity in a set of laws? Sure there could...but throwing out vitriolic words to get your point across is a bit foolhardy, don't you think? There are plenty of laws/sentencing guidelines on the books that don't make sense...and it used to be worse. Adultery and homosexual acts were considered jailable offenses by many states in the past...wouldn't shock me at all if some of those laws are still on the books.

[ewat]

maxine said:
"So ewat if you are so concerned about just yours, why are commenting at all about what someone else is doing"

maxine you missing the whole point. i can say what i wanna say when i wanna say it thats why. but anyway, all im doing is echoing what bill cosby is saying. but im going even further and calling it what it really is, niggas vs. black people. everybody got their problems black, white whoever. but the discussion is about blacks and their problems. its undeniable the condition black males are in. so quit trying to avoid that issue and address it head on. blacks are never going to get anywhere in the mainstream as long as they glorify pimps ganstas, hustlers, crooks, conmen, and drug dealers. there comes a time when you gotta leave that stuff out in the streets. you cant come on the job and not follow the rules, smoke weed, get drunk, come to work late, give everybody "the hook-up," and expect to keep the job. yet thats what a lot of blacks do, they wanna bring that ghetto nigga mentality into the mainstream. but the ghetto mentality and the mainstream cant mix. so what you have is blacks who know this and choose the ghetto mentality casue they think it is superior to the mainstream. and they end up dead or in jail think about it.
blacks need to address those issues before we start blaming the "white-man" and once we deal with that we can then deal with what the white-man is doing to us, if anything.

[B]

Some people like to complain about being disadvantaged, but when asked why they don't do something about it - well they just don't want to. case in point. many years ago my sister (of all people) said she wanted the finer things in life, she just didn't want to do what it took to get them. - Don't get me wrong, she has a decent job, drives a new car and has lots of 'stuff', but...

If someone wants to better themselves, there are many ways to get information, get educated and informed. Someone has to help themself before others can assist.

In regard to Cosby, it takes a very secure individual to speak the truth and speak against what we have been told/taught/brainwashed for many years.

[J-sizzle]

1. To Ewat: I'm actually a black phd student who bears a reponsiblity in working to correct these type of things, so I won't be simply demaning poor people twetny years from now.

2. I think if your going to keep generating media attention about an issue, you should be at least be proposing solutions. If you don't, it makes me question your motives. Bill Cosby hasn't been relavent since theo went to nyu, now hes in the news for simply ranting every week. Although his speeches have some nice gems, they aren't eactly loaded with statistics or useful policy solutions.

3. Ok lets take race out of the equation. When wealthy people like Ewing Kaufman complained about these very same problems, what did they do? They established foundations that do good work.

My arugment is this, unlike anyother ethnic group in this nation, the black elite (besides magic johnson and oprah) have not put their money where there mouth is. Is Bill Cosby obiligated to do something? Not at first. But when you keep making national healines like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson, you should do something. Power demands responisbility.

[Jokie McJokemaker]

I guess I missed where this thread is going. You all are name calling and blaming. Isn't that, not the answer. Forgot how whitey has held you down.(not really buying it) And start to think about solutions. How can we as "adults" (term used very loosely on here)show the children that there is more to life than the instant gratification that they are shown on video movies and around the corner.

This is the only thing that we need to discuss, not racism or what we came from, only what we can do

[Reminder 1,098,672 - Ewat]

j-sizzle having a phd means nothing. hell, i got a doctorate. means noting in this discussion. you call what cosby said demeaning blacks. i call it addressing a real problem with blacks. and until blacks stop getting offended when somene speaks the truth we are never gonna get anywhere. when a white says what cosby says they are wrong for saying it right? and when a black says it he's wrong too. can anybody mention this battle among blacks at all? if so who, and what can he say? does he have to get appoval from blacks first? thnk about it.

[ewat]

sorry about not posting my name ewat ewat ewat. this webtv is messed up sometime/
sorry

The fact is this; everyone can always pick out the bad in our race, living in the inner city I see alot of the crimes that are committed everyday. I listen to the Steve Harvey's show every morning and every Wednesday he brings another successful BLACK person on his show, he uplift our black business, he speaks of the possitive as well as the bad and when he gives his advise about black women he's