Mo. man shot and killed while stealing truck

In St. Louis, an 18-year-old was shot and killed when he reportedly to drive off with a pickup that its owner had left running outside a house early Sunday. The owner came out as he was driving off, though, and fatally shot the 18-year-old.

Comments

[Patman]

A hard lesson learned, is a good lesson learned.

DONT STEAL !!!

[You're a Sober Drunk R2D2]

good for the owner and the criminal. Tax money was saved on that and the owner should not face any charges either.

[Keith G. in P.V.]

No harm, no foul. Works for me.

[Brad]

Not sure about the death penalty for stealing a truck some moron left running.

[Searching]

I dont know Brad. I think death for stealing is a pretty good deterrent. Going to jail is more like a family reunion for a lot of these people.

[EsqEB]

Sure Brad, blame the victim. All too easy to do. Fact of the matter is, if the thief's mother and father had taught him to not take other people's things; then he would still be alive and the owner of the truck would not be using Google to figure out how to get brain stains out of upholstery.

[AJ]

LOL Searching, right on!!!

[Ein]

I don't have strong opinions in the gun debate (husband is a die-hard gun rights advocate). But I hope this truck owner is charged. Nobody's life was threatened. He just decided to kill this guy who was stealing a truck. I'd rather have the insurance check (which for me, probably wouldn't be enough to buy a similar vehicle) than to have willfully killed some kid who wanted to joy ride.

[anarchanon]

Carjacker gets himself killed in the act. *shrugs* Oh well, I suppose he made his own metaphorical bed.

[Patman]

ein-I only have liability because I'm poor. I cant afford to pay cash for another car, so I'd shoot to save myself $3,500 and if I killed him, well....see my first post.

[Elrond of Rivendell]

Unfortunately, acording to Missouri law the shooter is likely to be charged unless there is proof that his life was in danger, e.g. the driver of the stolen vehicle was trying to run him over as he left.

Doesn't have to make sense folks, its the law.

[Boogaloo Shrimp]

Was this guy sitting by the window with his gun in his hand just waiting for someone to try to steal his truck? That's what it sounds like to me.

[Brad]

On the next episode of "Bait Car"...

[G.Tripp]

Awesome!!

[killemall]

Well, at least he will not be a repeat offender.

[Bebe]

"Was this guy sitting by the window with his gun in his hand just waiting for someone to try to steal his truck?"

Probably not. He may have been carrying it on him in a holster though. Sounds like he was carrying illegally if he was then taken into custody on outstanding warrants.

[kpop]

I have a feeling this is not going to turn out so good for the victim of the theft.

[Lola]

If we made it legal to shoot someone over property, the legal snowball would be unbelievable. Once we make it a defense for some, it is a defense for all. That means it would open up the protection-of-property defense for all people charged with murder (Yes, that include drug-dealers and gang members.) The same thing has happened with the castle doctrine. I don't think that most of you who are so pro-gun on these sites would be so thrilled if you realized that the people that are benfitting the most for these NRA-backed laws are the people that you think you have to arm yourself against.

[Rasputin]

Kansas law allows deadly force only in the presence of a clear threat of injury or death to one self or others. I assume that Missouri is the same.

If this is true then the Missouri equivilent to volunary manslaughter is the most probable outcome.

[inetmail2003]

I have a MO CCW permit. As such I legally can use my weapon if I am a witness to a felony. If the man who shot the kid did indeed have a CCW permit, which sounds likely as he had a weapon close at hand, he will not be charged. I am a veteran and believe carring a weapon is an extreme responsibility and hope to never need to use mine. If I was in that situation I would let the truck go, I have insurance. Additionally, the truck owner is a fool for leaving it running without sitting in the truck! However, being a fool is not a crime.

[David]

Well the poor kid was probably just misunderstood, he was probably just going to wash and fill it up with gas for his neighbor! (RIGHT)

[kcsapps]

People need to understand that if you are going to commit a crime, something can go wrong and that includes someone dieing.

[KC Cicero]

Seriously. how can anyone with a conscience live with killing a kid over this? Really, a car thief is morally superior to a person who thinks this is OK.

Even setting aside the stupidity of leaving an unlocked vehicle running (Get a 2nd key & lock it up while you warm it up!) you have taken a young human life over possession of an inanimate object.

If anything, this is a strong argument against the ready availability of guns. I suspect that the shooter -- given the time to reflect -- might have made a better decision.

[Elrond of Rivendell]

"As such I legally can use my weapon if I am a witness to a felony."

inetmail2003

Not so. You'd better take your CCW class again.

Somebody has to be in immediate fear for their life in order for you to use deadly force.

[Elrond of Rivendell]

"this is a strong argument against the ready availability of guns"

Well Cicero, remember, 70 million law abiding citizens with ready availability to their guns, didn't commit any crimes yesterday.

Guns aren't the problem.

[quixotic]

Seems that this guy is using his gun as compensation for poor judgment in other areas. Use reasonable vigilance when securing your property rather than trying to deal with the aftermath of not doing so in a violent and destructive manner.

[Mary]

I understand the guy wanting to shoot the thief who attempted (and failed) to steal the truck. My decision on whether to feel sorry for the thief would be based on how many other prior offenses the 18 year old had already committed - was this his first grand auto theft or one of many crimes? I certainly wouldn't make my decision just because he was 18 years old. Either way, it is a lesson learned for the thief, albeit a bit belated...

[FlyBoyGA]

http://www.moga.mo.gov/statutes/chapters/chap563.htm

There you go! Missouri Defense of Justification Statutes...

inetmail2003 - You need to read this closely before you get yourself into trouble. It is individuals like yourself that make all CCW's look bad. This was not a forcible felony.

Defense of Property is not reason enough to use Deadly Force in Missouri.

[cac]

Isn't it against the law to leave your car running if you aren't in it?

[Drasil]

cac - Probably, let's make the victim be at fault. If I was to set a large screen TV outside of my house while moving, came inside to get additional items, and someone was driving off with it, does that make me the person at fault? Or does it make the person who stole it a scumbag taking advantage of a situation? You lock things up to keep honest people honest, not to deter dishonest people.

[FlyBoyGA]

There isn't a state law against it; can't speak for whichever county/city this took place in. For the few places that do have the law, it usually doesn't apply to vehicles on your property; it is more focused on roads on public roads, lots, etc.

[Joe]

This would be a case where the punishment does not fit the crime. So yes in this case, the criminal became the victim. Hey cowboy, it's a truck and certainly not worth any human life. Let the cops do their job.

[cac]

Drasil, I wasn't saying it was anyone's fault! I was simply asking a question. Same thing that will happen in a court over this deal.

Personally (sure this will get a lot of comments), I think the guy shouldn't have had his car running without being in it (if he made this a habit, he was ripe for picking on theft- probably watched for days) THEN, yes, any person involving themselves in a crime certainly have opened the door for retaliation (although in this case the punishment (death) didn't fit the crime), THEN, why did this man have a gun so readily available? Why not shoot out a tire and you still get to keep the truck. Why shoot the kid!

This will most likely end in more harsh punishment for both than should be the case. A teen making a stupid decision (regardless of who/what people want to blame ie: parents, home life, acne...) doesn't deserve to die. A man warming up his car doesn't deserve it to get stolen.

I'm sure lawyers will find a loop hole that will tick people off and create more laws/loopholes for more abuse of situations - it doesn't matter who you favor it will make someone mad.

Our entire system needs an overhaul! People committing crime don't get punished, they get sent off to an extended stay dorm house. There, they don't learn responsibility, skills, etc., they learn MORE ways to commit crime (and we wonder why recidivism is high)- the families of those imprisoned are the ones who suffer, paying high phone bills, sending money, traveling and visiting in a less than adequate space for hours, etc. (no, you don't have to, but family is family!)

Then, many who SHOULD be punished, get off on technicalities or simply just pay off the judge/attorney or whomever else can change an outcome, and then go back at it again.

Point being, prison isn't punishment it is temporary housing and FREE. Alternatively, courts are corrupt and you can pay your way out of anything, guilty or not.

This kid probably didn't think he would get in to much trouble for what he was doing. Stupid or just uninformed??

The man was probably fed up with things like this happening or the way our kids today behave and snapped! Didn't care about outcome!

I could go on and on... sad, sad, sad all the way around! What I DO KNOW, is that you should never judge any situation/persons actions until you have walked in identical shoes and that never happens!

[cinnamonbrown]

It was recently pasted (Missouri) that if you leave your car running (warming up etc.) you will be cited. I think the owner should be charged his life was not in danger
and the truck was definitely not worth losing a life by theft or other means.

[Barney Franks Hemroid]

The truck is more valuable than many of these scumbag's life. We have created a bunch of inhuman beings with our welfare system. I say shoot anyone who is trying to steal. It will cut down on stealing.

[Nivek9]

So how many years do you do in that "extended stay dorm" cac? You know so much about what it's like on the inside I can only assume you're an ex-con. Seriously I want to know more about it, things are getting pricey and my job isn't much fun. Maybe I'll commit a crime and get myself thrown in prison and relax for a while. How often will I get date night with my wife? Do they have HBO? Will I still get to go hunting in the fall with my brother? How's the fishing? Will I get to hang out with any of those famous and very rich prisoners that somehow weren't able to buy their way out like Phil Spector or John Gotti (never mind about Gotti, I just heard he died in prison)?

Point being... cac has no idea what he's talking about. All of the ex-cons I've talked to would just as soon stay far away from prison.

[Nivek9]

My previous post did not contain my opinion about the article at hand I just realized. Not that it matters but the punishment did not fit the crime. People can speculate about what the kid's record was, whether he was a habitual criminal, dangerous, whatever, but the guy that killed him didn't know those details either I suspect. He took another man's life over a truck plane and simple. But I'm sure his conscience will be just fine, along with many people that feel his actions were justified. But therein lies the problem.

[Jojoba]

Drasil said: "cac - Probably, let's make the victim be at fault. If I was to set a large screen TV outside of my house while moving, came inside to get additional items, and someone was driving off with it, does that make me the person at fault?"

Only if the TV was running. ;)

[Drasil]

The TV would only be running if it was being stolen.

[Jo Jo]

Marvelous. I deduce from these comments that the dum-dum baby crowd feels that the $h1tty decision-making of one gun owner typifies the lot of law-abiding gun owners. Congratulations.

[Drasil]

Jo Jo - you're assuming that the spoon-fed anti-gun crowd has a brain.

[One that Knows]

In reponse to kpop "If we made it legal to shoot someone over property, the legal snowball would be unbelievable."

This is the case in Texas.....You have to right to protect your person and property with deadly force. Dont see a lot of problems down here with this being abused, just used when needed. IE: Dont steal my stuff!

[Why So Socialist?]

Was the truck damaged? Was the upholstery stained? Why do they leave the important things out of these articles?

I am all for letting the cops do their job, but they don't. If the truck was ever recovered, the cops would have towed it and held the stripped vehicle for ransom. The thief would never have been found. Been there. Done that.

[Mikey V]

This is what is wrong with this country a man protects his property and he is the bad guy I have no sympathy for this theif if he had not been stealing he would not have gotten shot. this crap about "The poor crook and his rights" I would have shot him too. Good ridiance now he will not come and try to steal my stuff. And to all you fighting over the law, whatever it says you are not going to get a jury to convict this guy no way.

[What could have been]

Listen I don't agree with shooting someone to protect property. The point is being overlooked. If this kid had not been trying to take something that did not belong to him he would be alive today. Its poor jugement and stupidity. How would this converstation be going if the guy had not shot this fool and the kid took off with his stolen truck and in a hurry t-boned a women and her children killing a family. It happens. What caused all this was the truck being stolen. Thats it. The owner didn't go out looking to kill someone the kid came to him. OBEY THE LAW!!!

[doobiebrother]

This is such a sad and tragic stor...oh look!, its starting to snow again.

Well, the bright side is that his carbon footprint is much smaller now.

[JLB]

I am glad he got shot.

What would you be saying if your mom was out walking her dog when he was driving away in his stolen vehicle and ran her over? Criminals choose their path....

[Mamaw]

How do you people know he was trying to hit the thief? He may have hit him by accident. And I am tired of "it's your fault for leaving the car running" surely the thief knew it wasn't his. As for Kansas law, the make my day law says if someone enters your home without your permission you can shoot them. It does not say they have to threaten you or be armed.

[Larry]

I doubt the guy was necesarily trying to apply the "death penalty" to the thief. He just wanted his freakin truck back. I would have done the same.

[JB]

I hereby find you guilty and sentence you to an eternity burning in hell for stealing other peoples stuff.

I hate you libs. I swear your moonbat illogic defies explanation. Its a contagious illness really. This piece of crap decided to trespass on this mans property and attempted to drive off with his truck and you morons want to take up for him? You disgust me. I mean really?