Scott Roeder's supporters

Judy Thomas continues to cover the Scott Roeder trial for the Star, and this morning, she notes that his trial has drawn a string of anti-abortion activists to Wichita:

Among Roeder’s supporters attending besides Bray are Dave Leach, of Des Moines, who once published the Army of God manual, a how-to book on abortion clinic violence; Jennifer McCoy of Wichita, who spent time in prison for two abortion clinic arsons in Virginia; Regina Dinwiddie of Kansas City, who calls Roeder a hero; and Joshua Graff, who spent three years in prison for a 1993 clinic arson in the Houston area.

Anti-abortion activist Randall Terry, founder of Operation Rescue, left, demonstrates outside the Sedgwick County Courthouse Wednesday, Jan. 27, 2010, in Wichita, Kan. Operation Rescue, which is based in Wichita and has condemned Tiller's slaying, said Terry hasn't been affiliated with the group for more than 17 years. (AP Photo/Orlin Wagner)

Comments

[cripjak]

Nobody I'd like better as character references than a few convicted felons.

[Jane]

"a witness on Monday had testified that he heard Roeder say “Lord, forgive me,” as he ran out of the church after shooting Tiller.

“Scott said he did not say that,” Leach said.

That’s significant, Leach said, because Roeder doesn’t believe he did anything to be forgiven for."

Those wacky Christians.

[Drasil]

Thanks Jane for your anti-Christian sentiments.

[Chuck McRizzo]

It's scary when nut-jobs find a cause be it anything. They always seem to ruin it for the good people,.

And lets not forget Jane that Stalin was an athiest, whats his death toll up to?

[cripjak]

Thanks Jane for your anti-Christian sentiments.

Posted by: Drasil
I don't think Jane is anti-christian. I think she was just referring to the extremeist faction. She might have had a little sarcasm thrown in there too.

[rmutt1917]

Chuck - I've never seen anyone claim that Josef Stalin killed in the thrall of atheism. He killed to consolidate political power, which countless totalitarians (of countless religious persuasions) have done. The difference is that Roeder claims to have killed as a profession of his faith. Although maybe he is more a frontman for a political power movement, a modern day Gavrilo Princip.

[Jane]

I'm not anti christian... I'm anti hypocrite.

Just so you know I'm not an athiest I don't have enough faith to be one.

[Predictable]

I also feel Jane was being ironic and pointing out the seemingly bottomless pit of Christian hypocrisy across the board, but particularly amongst the most 'devout'.

[Predictable]

Oh--I totally called it.

[Drasil]

I don't recall anywhere in the New Testament that says, "kill abortion doctors." For that matter, I don't recall anything that recommends killing anyone for anything in the New Testament. Of course there are people that will kill no matter what religion they are (or not related to any religion.) Whack jobs are everywhere.

[Chuck McRizzo]

No see thats the mis-nomer, they aren't devout at all. They are pretending to be Christians if they truly were Christians they know that no wrong can over turn another wrong.

So no Roeder isn't a Christian, he may think he is but he's really not.

I can call myself a Jedi all I want, but Yoda's not coming to my funeral.

[Chuck McRizzo]

rmutt1917

And yes Stalin did murder, persecute and maim all sorts of religious groups in the name of Athiesm. It went along with his whole dictatorship. You can only worship him/mother Russia, anything else is wrong and if you don't believe that you're going to be buried.

[scott roeder's left nut]

There are plenty of people that kill in the name of their religion and our government is spending billions of dollars and thousands of lives to kill those people first...so why just kill the muslim extremists??? Shouldn't our government also be killing Christian extremists that pose a threat as well??

[Vibiana]

If you look in the dictionary under "lunatic," there's a photograph of Regina Dinwiddie.

[ProChoice]

Glad to see that there are some Christians still out there that think everyone should believe in their religion and are willing to use force to make people follow it. For some reason "tyrant" comes to mind...weird. Didn't god order someone to kill women and their unborn children in the Bible a couple times? I love the Hippocratic attitude!

[Predictable]

I think there has been much more violence done in God's name than done in Atheism's name . . . and Christians have been historically slower than they should to condemn it.

[Chuck McRizzo]

Pro Choice, I think you need to lay off the pipe, or you're reading the wrong Bible.

I don't know between Stalin and Hitler alone Atheisms death tally is pretty high. I mean if you go by percentages as far as how many people were around at the time when something happened maybe but overall I think those two are pretty up there.

And again you can say it's in God's name but that's usually used by people who don't know anything in the first place.

People just hate people in general, they make up whatever reason necessary to kill each other.

[Jane]

I agree Predictable. I find it ironic that when a Christian does something asshatery other Christians are quick to point out they are not a “real Christian.” When a Muslim does something asshatery they are quick to judge all of them.

[Jane]

Hitler wasn't an Atheist.... he was Catholic.

[Predictable]

You cant paint a target on someone (i.e. Tiller), yell and scream and call him a murderer, and then shrug your shoulder's and say 'what did I do?' when someone perpetrates violence.

I feel a belief in some 'deity' . . . I dont really care what or who . . . has been responsible for most of the war and suffering in the world.

I think it's a tough argument to compare the religious motivations of Stalin and/or Hitler to Crusaders and Jihad-ists.

[bowl300]

Ah nuts, Chuck, can you try a little harder when you call yourself a Jedi? I'd really like to get Yoda's autograph.

[Jane]

I forgot…the current Pope was a farkin Nazi!

[Patty PV]

Here ya go Chuck:

Those who would make Hitler an atheist should turn their eyes to history books before they address their pews and microphones. Acclaimed Hitler biographer, John Toland, explains his heartlessness as follows: "Still a member in good standing of the Church of Rome despite detestation of its hierarchy, he carried within him its teaching that the Jew was the killer of god. The extermination, therefore, could be done without a twinge of conscience since he was merely acting as the avenging hand of god..."

Hitler's Germany amalgamated state with church. Soldiers of the vermacht wore belt buckles inscribed with the following: "Gott mit uns" (God is with us). His troops were often sprinkled with holy water by the priests. It was a real Christian country whose citizens were indoctrinated by both state and church to blindly follow all authority figures, political and ecclesiastical.

Hitler, like some of today's politicians and preachers, politicized "family values." He liked corporal punishment in home and in school. Jesus prayers became mandatory in all schools under his administration. While abortion was illegal in pre-Hitler Germany he took it to new depths of enforcement, requiring all doctors to report to the government the circumstances of all miscarriages. He openly despised homosexuality and criminalized it. If past is prologue, we know what to expect if liberty becomes license.

[D]

He made a CHOICE on whether or not to kill an abortion doctor.

I think it was wrong, but that's my CHOICE.

[Patty PV]

So much for atheism's death toll. If you can't impress them with baseless rumors, impress 'em with the facts.

[kittymom]

Predictable, as for violence done in God's name: the greatest crimes in human history have been committed in the name of religion.

[Chuck McRizzo]

Patty never knew that I stand corrected.

And Jane stop making comments about Christians with the implications that ALL christians think the same way. Find one instance of me saying that Islam is a terrorist religion and I'll give you $50.00. People are people psycho's are psycho and unfortunantly they make the group as a whole look terrible.

[ANM]

Fringe fanatics and the crazy wack jobs that follow them blindlessly....
The true scourge on planet Earth.
To smite is a right. lol

A good education including a comprehensive look at human history could do so much to end all of it.

[Jane]

Never Chuck, I'm still going to make fun of you wacky christians.

[Chuck McRizzo]

Glad to see you used a non-biased source Patty....

[Jane]

Because we all know the Catholic Church is NOT biased!

[Chuck McRizzo]

Again, find an example of where I said the Catholic Church wasn't and I'll give you $50.00.

But it'd be like me using a Catholic Text on abortion stats and claiming its not baised (which obviously it would be)

And you don't have to stop making fun of us. I mean my being in this word has a meaning to me and I'm always striving toward a higher purpose after death. If you'e happy just being worm food more power to ya.

[Jane]

I never said you said the Catholic Curch wasn't biased.

But you pointed out that Patty's statement was biased.

I was pointing out that you believe in a church that is biased.

so we are back to the hypocrisy I spoke of earlier.

And whether I become warm food or not when I die, I don’t know. I’m sure as hell not going to follow a church lead by a dress wearing former nazi that wears $10,000 Prada slippers who lives in a palace and preaches to the masses that we all should live humble lives to find higher purpose after death. Oh, and before you die can you please give me a lot of your money. Talk about a con job!

[Jane]

I never said you said the Catholic Curch wasn't biased.

But you pointed out that Patty's statement was biased.

I was pointing out that you believe in a church that is biased.

so we are back to the hypocrisy I spoke of earlier.

And whether I become warm food or not when I die, I don’t know. I’m sure as hell not going to follow a church lead by a dress wearing former nazi that wears $10,000 Prada slippers who lives in a palace and preaches to the masses that we all should live humble lives to find higher purpose after death. Oh, and before you die can you please give me a lot of your money. Talk about a con job!

[Steve]

"Atheism's death toll" ... you crack me up.

[Keith G. in P.V.]

Chuck, for starters, consider this:

If I wanted to be a Catholic and follow its teachings, I'd be in the pews with you on Sunday.

I have no problem with what you believe. I have A HUGE EFFING PROBLEM with the Catholic church demanding I follow their "morality", believer or not.

I have A HUGE EFFING PROBLEM with the Catholic church telling Catholic politicians they must vote as the Church says or be punished religiously. Why? Because if I vote for a Catholic, I'm forced to take along his or her faith as baggage on every issue. Well, not every. It's not ok to murder convicts or non-human globs of future people, but it's ok to fight wars and kill anonymously. It's also ok to cover up sexual abuse of children and sexual relations with other parishioners in violation of the Church's theology.

I REALLY don't mean to bash the Catholic Church any more than I bash any other organized faith. I can find hypocrisy, deceit and cover-ups in all religions aw well as in the absence of religion just by reading the paper.

[Chuck McRizzo]

Ahh so the fact that he defected you don't care about, or that ALL german boys were essentially forced into service.

It's funny that the Synagauge he went to really didn't care and actually welcomed him with open arms. But I mean you know more about that whole situation than the Jewish Leaders do I'm sure.

The church doesn't ASK for your money when you die, most people OPENLY give it to the church. MY family gave a large portion of land in the StL area to the church. They didn't ask my family just donated it. I think there's a retreat on it now.

What the church asks for is a portion of what you make ask alms to the poor. And do a quick good search of all the Catholic/Christian hospitals, shelters, food pantry's etc etc vs those run by Secular or Atheist organizations.... Yeah thought so. But yeah I mean free hospital care to those who can't afford it what a crock and guess what My tithe pays for it and it feels good. But yeah I'm sure Keith and Jane do more good in the world than the Catholic church does.

How many hospitals do you run again?

[TerryMKC]

Using acclaimed Hitler biographer, John Toland, as a source of Hitler facts is still much more unbiased for factual history than pulling a fact out of your hind end.

[Rasputin]

"I believe today that I am acting in the sense of the Almighty Creator.
By warding off the Jews I am fighting for the Lord's work."
[Adolph Hitler, Speech, Reichstag, 1936]

"Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious
instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation
is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be
derived from faith . . . we need believing people."
[Adolf Hitler, April 26, 1933, from a speech made during
negotiations leading to the Nazi-Vatican Concordant of 1933]

"I believe today that my conduct is in accordance
with the will of the Almighty Creator."
[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp. 46]

"What we have to fight for...is the freedom and independence
of the fatherland, so that our people may be enabled to fulfill
the mission assigned to it by the Creator."
[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp. 125]

"This human world of ours would be inconceivable without
the practical existence of a religious belief."
[Adolph Hitler, _Mein Kampf_, pp.152]

"I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so"
[Adolph Hitler, to Gen. Gerhard Engel, 1941]

[Drasil]

Name me a church, christian, muslim, hindu or otherwise that isn't biased. Name me an atheist that isn't biased against religion, for that matter. Bias is just a fact of life. People do good works, people do bad works. The definition of what's good or bad is sometimes a gray area defined by peoples beliefs. Their beliefs may be screwed up, but that doesn't make everyone with their belief system screwed up. If that were the case, every white person would be cannibals (like Jeffrey Dahmer.)

[Manny The Manhandler]

Sounds like a "Who's who" of Pro Life Terrorists to me. I wonder why the Bush Administration never went after these Domestic Terrorists?

If he and his Ilk and Cronies all hate Terrorists (And this includes you right wing wacko's of today) Then why aren't you all angry over these Domestic Terrorists, Murderers and Thugs and wanting them arrested and sent to Gitmo?

[Chuck McRizzo]

I wouldn't have an issue with domestic terrorists going to gitmo. I think now though they can't because they aren't considered enemy combatants.

[Jane]

American Civil Liberties Union
Amnesty International
Doctors without Borders
Oxfam International
The Nature Conservancy
S.H.A.R.E.
Rotary/Rotary International
UNICEF
Red Cross
Toys for Tots
Disabled American Veterans
National Rifle Association of America
Harvesters

[Jane]

It was nice of your family to donate so much to support the pope’s shoe fetish.

[Jane]

Now tell me this ain't a pimp hat... I bet the popemoble is sitting on 20's.

[Ruth]

Killing is wrong wether it is in the womb or as an adult. both are murders!!

[Chuck McRizzo]

What was that list of Jane?

And how would a retreat get anyone more shoe's? You don't pay anything to go to a retreat.. I'm confused.

I didn't say the pope didn't look like Darth Siddious, I'm just sayin he isn't a bad person.

[GetAClue]

ProChoice: What Bible are you referring to when you say: "Didn't god order someone to kill women and their unborn children in the Bible a couple times?" Was it found in the waiting room of Planned Parenthood? You might try actually making sure you know what you are talking about before you make stupid comments again. Although several kings (Kings, mortals, stupid, evil men) did call for boys under a certain age to be killed, GOD never did. What turned you so against Christianity? There are hypocrites in every religion, and those claiming no religion. There are fanatics amoung every group of people, whether religious or not. I have never tried to "force" someone to change their beliefs. However, I do share what I believe, and if in so doing, that makes me a fanatic or a hypocrite in your eyes, so be it.

[Jane]

Chuck, those are secular organizations

[Jane]

GetAClue, your bible states:

The tenth and final plague of Egypt was the death of all Egyptian first born

This is what the LORD says: 'About midnight I will go throughout Egypt. Every firstborn son in Egypt will die, from the firstborn son of Pharaoh, who sits on the throne, to the firstborn son of the slave girl, who is at her hand mill, and all the firstborn of the cattle as well. There will be loud wailing throughout Egypt—worse than there has ever been or ever will be again. ”
— Exodus 11:4–6

Numbers 31:17 (Moses) “Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every women that hath known man by lying with him.”

In other words: women that might be pregnant, which clearly is abortion for the fetus.