Tragic situation in Iraq

On Page A-12 of the Jan. 3 Star, I was appalled to see an article entitled “Iraqi refugee crisis simmers.”

The accompanying photo shows Iraqi young men crowding on a bus to flee the country. This was the day after the United States announced 3,000-plus deaths of U.S. servicemen and women, not to mention the thousands coming home without body parts and with head injuries.

To see this photo makes me sick to my stomach. Why are we sending our young men and woman to “free” a country when they will not fight for that freedom themselves?

Now our president wants to send greater numbers to Iraq. More American servicemen and women will have their lives risked and more will have their lives ended. The November vote showed the U.S. citizens did not want this, and once again President Bush ignored of us.

As Keith Olbermann pointed out on MSNBC, the president has deadened the collective mind of this country to the pointlessness of an endless war, against the wrong people, in the wrong place, at the wrong time.

Our service members will be sacrificed so that Bush can say he did not “lose” in Iraq. Our meaningless sacrifice must stop.

Daryle Heldenbrand
Lee’s Summit

Comments

[Thomas Kirby]

Taking insult because someone informs you that you have been swindled just helps the swindler, who wants you to feel that way. A man can't rob you blind unless he gets you on his side, and makes you feel that he is on yours. Then you become complicit in your own fleecing, maybe even in your own murder, and your own ego prevents you from admitting that something is wrong with the situation.

[Sophie Demartine]

Jack, I don't know you or your son and I don't pretend to. The fact that I know for a fact the invasion of Iraq was motivated by greed and lust for power and based on outright lies and say so clearly you take as an insult to your son. You conclude that I think your son is a chump for signing up. The truth is I don't , the American people who voted for Bush are chumps or worse immoral but not our soldiers necessarily.

Being a chump is not such a bad thing really, it just means you've been had, someone else was more clever than you and got you to do something you wouldn't do if you knew the truth. Being a chump means you're a victim of your lack of natural intelligence or your ego being too big or incompetent parents or being afraid or poor education or all those things. However being a chump is a lot better than being immoral.

Most soldiers, not all, but most are neither chumps nor immoral, yet some are real psychopaths and I'm sure your son knows one or two.

Cindy Sheehan tried to stop her son signing up for the invasion (like many parents) but failed because her son had two very good reasons for going, one, his best friends were going and he wanted to be there with them, he wouldn't be able to live with himself if one of them got killed and two, he believed the lies of Bush/Rove, Cheney , Powell, Rice, etc that perhaps Saddam Hussein did have a connection to 911 and that Iraq was a stronghold for Al Qaida. At the emotional time just after 911 most of us were duped because we have this idiotic tendency to believe our Presidents won't lie to us. This is a result of poor education, the first thing any good parent or teacher should teach children is never trust power, never trust authority, always think for yourself. In America we don't do this enough, our history is often fixed and teachers that really teach well are often fired from their jobs by religious fascist wackos.

Even Cindy Sheehan half believed the lies in the beginning and couldn't argue with her son's motivations, so she let him go.

Is her son a chump for going? No, he went to protect his friends and believed perhaps he was protecting his country as well, though he wasn't absolutely sure, yet his patriotism got the best of him, anyway very noble motivations. I truly believe most of the soldiers are truly noble though there are some that are there because they're psychopath's or victims of injustice. Rumsfeld is responsible for increasing the number of psychopath's in our military, they should have been weeded out, yet they make good torturers.

Jack, it is obvious from your posts you know the truth but you have a problem getting off your tuff and protesting like Cindy Sheehan getting active to end this war, your blogs show you are against the war but you're afraid to really take a strong stand against it. Or maybe you are active, what do I know.

However, today, the reasons for this invasion are now obvious and there is no excuse for anyone today to accept the lies and not be active to end this war and impeach and imprison the criminals who got us into it.

I admit I write these blogs out of frustration or more accurately ANGER, I admit it is easy and takes no courage to do so, yet believe me I have acted too and have actually been in dangerous situations myself, not as a soldier but in other activities and in far off lands, yet that's my problem.

I will also let you in on my true motivation, I'll be totally honest, I'm not Angry because our soldiers are being killed, I think that's tragic and that makes me sad, but not angry. What makes me ANGRY is seeing the pictures of little Iraqi children who have nothing to do with this greed and lust for power and we the American people are doing this to them!!!

We are killing and maiming innocent children with our bombs in Iraq with our bombs in Lebanon with our bombs in Somalia and soon with our bombs in Iran because we're too God damned lazy and afraid to get off our tuffs and protest, impeach and put in prison these war mongers....these children are the reason I am against the war and want it stopped NOW!

You know what's worse than death , Jack, I'm sure you do and I hope your son does not become a victim of it like so many Vietnam Vets have and that is being part of inadvertently killing innocent children. I personally would rather be dead than be a part of that because that kills your conscious your soul not just your body. We are putting our young boys in that situation day in and day out, they deserve better leadership so they don't make mistakes inadvertently that will haunt them the rest of their lives.

Terrorism is a result of our addiction to oil, it's a result of corrupt politicians and oil executives, if we want to stop terrorism we have to get off the oil habit.

What makes me ANGRY, Jack, is that many Americans want to stay addicted to oil and don't mind sending people like your son to fight terrorism so they can fill up their huge cars and run their AC units 24/7, instead of putting solar panels or wind turbines on their roofs or driving electric cars.

In short Jack, I don't think Cindy Sheehan's son is a chump, I'm sure yours is not either , I don't expect him to leave Iraq either if he's there to protect his buddies. I actually I respect him for that. Its not his job to leave its our job to get him and his buddies out of there.

Let me put it this way, if you saw the film “Legends of the Fall” Brad Pitt plays the role of someone against the War yet goes to fight to protect his brother. His Father played by Anthony Hopkins is adamantly against his sons going to fight even though he was a war “hero” himself. Go rent this film, it is excellent, read the book too, I'm sure you'll get a lot out of it. Send the book and DVD to your son. This film reflects my attitude towards soldiers and war.

[jack]

engineer and old drum: Do you notice the big war supporters who denigrate our troops forget small (but IMO important) facts like there are not 2100 war dead, there are well over three thousand by "war related causes" alone. This doesn't include those dead of "non-war related causes" but they are still dead.

They also forget the over 20,000 wounded. Again the "non-combat related" wounded do not count. My son was electrocuted when the Colonel of the Humvee he was "gunning" for decided it would be quicker to go under some power lines instead of through traffic and the antenna touched a 220 volt line (he was dead on the ground except for the heroism of the helicopter pilot). Except he does not count as a casualty because this was not "enemy action".

They also "forget" the dead of the "non-combatants".

I continue to be extremely ambivalent about the war in Iraq. I so wish that the sacrifice of my son and so many others is for more than the President's ego.

But I read/listen to those of Sophies stripe who openly state that people like my son are "chumps". They talk like they feel sorry for our troops. That they have been taken advantage of.

I then read/listen to the people who compare what my son, and what the rest of the troops have done, to things like Washington D.C., and their obvious sneering at our troops. And I realize one thing. Those of Sophie's stripe care far more about them than do those of the "They should be grateful to be in Iraq instead of Washington" type do.

Only those that sneer at the sacrifice of our troops claim to be "patriots" while denigrating both our troops and those like Sophie.

They should feel ashamed of themselves. But, I doubt they have the ability. They hide under the covers while others fight for their right to be cowards. Then they yell, "I voted. I did my part!"

Yep. You did your part. You should be deeply grateful to all those who have sacrificed for your right to be a coward.

[Engineer]

Old Drum
Now that they have it, what are they going to do with it?

[Old Drum]

Mark Robertson makes the following observations:

By the way, the pro-Iraq war, Democrat Senator Joe Lieberman,as an Independent, beat the anti-Iraq war, Ned Lamont, in the very liberal state of Connecticut. Thankyou.

OK, but he didn't mention:

Jim Talent, pro-Iraq war --- defeated by a Democratic who is not very pro-Iraq war.

Conrad Burn, pro-Iraq war --- defeated by a Democratic who is very anti-Iraq war.

George "Macaca" Allen, pro-Iraq war --- defeated by a Democratic who opposed the Iraq war before it began.

Rick Santorum, pro-Iraq war --- defeated by a Democratic who is not very pro-Iraq war.

Mike Dewine, pro-Iraq war --- defeated by a Democratic who voted against the Iraq war.

Of course, Lincoln Chafee, anti-Iraq war, but enabled the Republican majority to "stay the course" -- defeated by a Democrat, also anti-Iraq War, who would not support the Republican majority.

Mark, did you notice the Democrats now control the Senate and the House.

[Sophie Demartine]

Mike d, you forgot 700,000 dead Iraqis and millions more seriously wounded, a third of them children under 15, you should check out the pictures of the children, they'll make you weep, maybe if you do, next time you'll think twice before writing crap like that. You also forgot 30,000 of our boys also seriously injured some with fates worse than death.

DC more dangerous than Iraq, where did you get that email? Limbaugh, O'Reilly, the GOP Propaganda machine?

All this death and destruction is a result of our addiction to oil, Carter tried to turn us to renewable energy, make us energy Independent, but the Reagan/Bush propaganda machine crushed him, if Carter would have won against Reagan and Bush, we'd be energy independent today or close to it.

The evil genius behind the Republican propaganda machine is
Reichsministerium für Volksaufklärung und Propaganda, Karl Rove.

He so smart he doesn't have a college degree, his father left his mother, who committed suicide later, he was bullied and unpopular in school, poor guy...this guy has a bone to pick with Humanity and he found his weapon of choice in the Bush family. This guy is getting his revenge and big time.
He's the reason King George will ask for more sacrificial blood tomorrow, he's the one who will give King George the words to dupe the American people once again.

[whispering_to_kc]

You're 22 times more likely to get killed by a car bomb or a sniper while shopping for apples in Baghdad than while shopping for oranges in DC.

Conclusion: a diet rich in oranges will add years to your life.

[whispering_to_kc]

The Rep. Steve King(R-Iowa)/Newsmax figures in your e-mail are both old and wrong. Unless Iraqis don't count as 'human beings', whose violent deaths aren't worth recording?

The violent death rate in Iraq (since 2003) is 770 deaths/100,000 population.

The violent death rate in DC (2005) is 34 deaths/100,000 population.

Conclusion: violent death is more likely for those who aren't ducking behind blast walls.

Iraq, a place with loose gun controls where everyone has an AK-47/RPG launcher in the closet, should be NRA heaven.

[jack]

It is safer to fly in an airplane than to take a shower in your own home. Conclusion? Apples vs oranges arguements have no real point. They are generally used by people who don't have solid reasoning to support their position.

[whispering_to_kc]

Ah, but 97% of the guns used in DC crimes originate from outside the District, in bordering states where gun laws are looser.

Conclusion: the USA should attack Maryland and Virginia.

[mike d]

The following is neither an indictment or support of the war in Iraq. I got it in an email today and found it interesting (I would say amusing but I don't want the wrath of Sophie to rain down on me)

If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the
Iraq theater of operations during the last 22 months, and a total of 2,112
deaths during that time, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per month
per 100,000 soldiers.
The firearm death rate in Washington, DC is 80.6 per month per 100,000 for
the same period.
That means that you are about 25% more likely to be shot and killed in the
US Capitol, which has the strictest gun control laws in the nation, than
you are in the WAR in Iraq.

Conclusion: The US should pull out of Washington.

[Engineer]

Joe
"Ray wrote "He was an alcoholic, coke addict, party animal, all signs of weak character". Ray who and where did he write this? If you are takling about this thread I think you will find that Sophie is the only one who wrote anything of this order. And could you give me a link to where President Bush said that the Iraqi was was either his personal agenda or his presonal crusade? I listen to him often and have never heard these thoughts expressed.

[Engineer]

Every once in a while Sophie says something with which I can agree. The exchange quoted below is one of those times:
Ray "It may be theoretically possible that somewhere in this world there is someone more rude and irrational than you but luckily I have not had the misfortune to meet that hypothetical person"
Sophie: "and I'm absolutely sure you never will, Ray."
Sophie is correct, talk about "Mission Impossible".

[Joe]

Ray wrote "He was an alcoholic, coke addict, party animal, all signs of weak character."

Geez man, what planet did you get up on this morning?

Obviously you are talking about, or spouting about, something you know nothing about. You do not have one idea what you are talking about.

I am NOT supporting Bush ... he is one scary SOB. He has said time and time again, in many different direct ways, that this war is his personal agenda. It is his personal crusade.

[KenLewis]

The Iraq war is not about terrorism. Not about freedom either. Not about anything, but the big ego of the President. He will sacrafice anything or anyone to preserve it.

[Sophie Demartine]

Jack I'm sorry but I take offense at that, I'm for getting your son out of that hell hole ASAP and Robertson is for keeping him there forever if so desired by our President.

I'm for giving your son a new Commander in Chief worthy of your son and all our soldiers, Robertson thinks he's already worthy of your son.

I'm for more funding for veterans benefits and better equipment for our soldiers, Robertson is for more profits for Halliburton and ExxonMobil.

We are not two sides of the same coin, we are poles apart...and you dishonor yourself when you say things like that.

[jack]

ray: Since I quit reading anything posted by either Sophie or Mark Robertson (IMO two sides/one coin), I enjoy this blog much more.

katman: You are probably right. I thought, "The writer just lost a whole bunch of people," the instant I saw the former sports reporters name. I react the same way to the failed comedian.

[Sophie Demartine]

and I'm absolutely sure you never will, Ray.

[Ray Seay]

Sophie Demartine,

It may be theoretically possible that somewhere in this world there is someone more rude and irrational than you but luckily I have not had the misfortune to meet that hypothetical person.

[Sophie Demartine]

How about Sophie Demartine, a Conservative Liberal, how's that for an oxymoron!

George Bush is not a leader, he does not have the stuff of a “Commander and Chief”, he was a frat rat draft dodger during Vietnam, like so many other Republicans. He was an alcoholic, coke addict, party animal, all signs of weak character. He was a cheerleader not a football player. He was a party animal, with no morals, no backbone, no courage, no integrity, self serving, East Coast elitist...he had all the makings of a great used car salesman, religious preacher, oil industry executive or lobbyist, but President of the biggest Democracy in the World with his finger on 10,000 nuclear weapons! Now how absurd is that!
Now he's a religious fanatic who talks to God, who thinks God chose him to be President so he can conquer the World.

His parents taught him to never back down, to always demand respect, that they were better than the common folk, that the common folk are sheep for the slaughter, to be used and brainwashed to strengthen the Bush Dynasty in money and power. That the world is a game of Risk and that they rolled the dice.

Bush has put all his armies on Iraq and Afghanistan, he keeps rolling and rolling coming up with 1's and 2's and 3's while Moqtada al-Sadr and the Taliban war lords keep rolling 5's and 6's. Even though Bush came in with vastly superior financial strength and the strongest army in the World, he's been quite unlucky so far.

He's transferred almost all his armies from South America leaving only the minimum to hold the Continent and Chavez has taken advantage of recent cards to conquer South America on his last turn. Chavez is now going for Colombia and Mexico and will probably get them this time around when its his turn again. (Maybe God is talking to Bush after all)

Bush is apparently now going to use the remainder of his cards and is putting all his armies again in Iraq to try and finally take the Middle East.

Putin and Hu Jintao have been holding their cards up until now but on their next turn they may have to use them, as you can only hold cards so long.

Khamenei (he has the real power not Ahmadi-Nejad as the press would like us to believe) has been holding his cards too but he may be forced to use them soon also.

Olmert fearful that Khamenei has good cards wants to provoke a confrontation with him now rather than later so Bush will have to use his armies and so he won't have to use his own, after rolling so poorly in Lebanon.

Blair has decided to hold his cards for the moment and to strengthen for the future, finally listening to his Generals and his people, deciding to minimize his losses.

Pelosi , Baker and America's Generals are urging Bush to do the same but their advice is falling on deaf ears because Rove has assured him this time the dice will roll well. Bush has absolute confidence in Rove's judgment, after all he did judge the American people pretty well...until recently anyway.

As for Shinzo Abe, Merkel, Chirac, Prodi etc., they've decided they don't want to play this game and propose to play Monopoly or Bioviva instead.

Who will win this game of Risk?

[Mark Robertson]

So you're the one who watches MSDNC. Keith Olberman is like a satire of someone like Keith Olberman.
It is hard to imagine, but MSNBC may be more bizarre than CNN. It is quite obvious when Keith Olberman hears truth, because he becomes more unglued than normal, as when news coverage of the war in Iraq is critiqued as biased.
Chris Matthews is nearly as bad and biased.(but not as kooky)I remember seeing a promo for his show once that featured a guest lineup of Bill Mahr and General Wesley Clark. Speaking of rather be watching paint dry. Do they have any idea why no one watches them?
The Iraq war is tough. President Bush took a great risk for safety and freedom that may yet pay off. Mistakes have been made and adjustments are being made. Our brave and great military will win the war in Iraq and the overall war on terrorism if they are allowed to.
By the way, the pro-Iraq war, Democrat Senator Joe Lieberman,as an Independent, beat the anti-Iraq war, Ned Lamont, in the very liberal state of Connecticut. Thankyou.

Mark Robertson
Independence

[katman]

As a moderate Conservative, I make a point to read the 'other point of view'. I read yours until I saw the name Keith Olbermann. How would you react to my column if I quoted Rush Limbaugh? I'm more interested in your ideas than Maureen Dowd or Keith Olbermann.

KATMAN