More apologies needed

In regard to “Clinton, Obama failed test” (9/24, Letters), I would like to make a few observations.

Perhaps apologies by these candidates “to the nation and to Gen. (David) Petraeus” are in order, but first maybe a few other apologies might be worth consideration.

We have seen John Kerry “Swift Boated,” John McCain’s patriotism and honor questioned, and Max Cleland referred to as unpatriotic.

As for the referral to Gen. Petraeus, it’s worth noting that the “betray us” phrase was first coined by Rush Limbaugh in referring to Sen. Chuck Hagel. (Earlier this year, he called him “Sen. Betrayus”). Has Limbaugh apologized? Has Karl Rove?

Is the White House (“We are not into nation building”) going to apologize for the lies perpetrated on the American people?

It appears the “radical left” is not the only one that owes apologies to the American people.

Ron Monnig
Slater, Mo.

Comments

[JUNGLEJACK]

Jack - I see your point. I, for one, am tired of all the endless "apologies" and cries for even more. If someone misspoke that's one thing, but I'm more inclined to believe that an off-the-cuff remark is more of an accurate representation of a politician's state of mind than a prepared speech - but that's just me.

But, Jack, you have to admit that the left tends to attack the messenger rather than debate the issues. Just like the examples I gave earlier - those on the right are constantly being accused of acting upon purely selfish motives on every issue from abortion to social security.

Can't we just agree that most of those on both sides pretty much have the country's best interests at heart, but have widely differing views on how we should face or overcome our national issues?

[jack]

jj: While I agree with you to some extent, I believe you have fallen into the trap of debating who the bigger scumbag is. Welcome to the club, so have I on many occassions.

I think this is what the politicians, regardless of the lable they claim, want to have happen. As long as the debate is about who owes who an "apology" the politicians can count their bribes...er, I mean..."contributions", while accomplishing nothing.

The simple minded will believe that any politician who claims a particular lable is "good" and all with the other lable are "bad". These are the ones that "rate the patriot" and "rate the traitor" games appeal to. As long as they can point fingers at someone and declare themselves better than, they are happy.

The rest of us, right, left and middle, must take control or our Nation is going to go down the tubes. It is past mattering who's "fault" everything is. That is a game politicians like to play. It accomplishes nothing. The only thing that matters is "What are you going to do now" and this the politicians want to avoid at all costs.

Positive change needs to happen in a bunch of areas. The politicians at all levels MUST start being held accountable for their actions. As long as the "I'm more insulted than you are" game is allowed to continue, this can't happen.

Let the "base" pat each other on the back for how deeply they hold the other side in contempt. That is apparently the best they are capable of. The rest of us need to take control and force our "leadership" to take meaningful action and hold themselves accountable.

[Engineer]

IMO, the thing to remember here is that this ad pretty well defines MoveOn.Org. And, IMO, her failure to condemn the ad pretty well defines HRC. She seems to me to be in the pocket of that organization and the man who provides its funding. But perhaps her own insult direct to the General was enough to define her without this additional matter.

[BuddyT]

Uh, lower case jack...what you think about "what I think" does not even jiggle the needle on my give-a-crap-o-meter.....

Go nominate yourself again...you will feel better...lmao once again...!

I guess we can all post...and I guess some of us take a little more care than others...

[JUNGLEJACK]

Jack - I wholeheartedly agree with your comments concerning the lack of attention to the real issues. But I'm afraid even in this context there is a great deal of "one-upsmanship" that goes on (mainly on the left) when dealing with issues.

For instance: if you don't tow the line for national health care, then you must be in the pocket of the big insurance companies.

If you want the immigration laws enforced then you are an insensitive bigot.

If you question the wisdom of raising the minimum wage then you are (at best) indifferent to the plight of the poor.

... and the beat goes on. I'm sorry, Jack, but it's overwhelmingly on the left where we see such intolerence to a differing opinion.

[Chris40]

Clinton did it too.
Posted by: T. Hanson | Sep 29, 2007 2:18:53 PM

Good point. Clinton was perhaps the first president to come right out and flatly state that "I loathe the military." But, to be fair, Clinton got it much worse than MoveOn.org; he was impeached, not merely condemned.

[Arminius]

T. Hanson:

"Clinton did it too."
http://www.ishipress.com/osamaint.htm

[jack]

BuddyT: If you weren't so obviously trying to impress everyone with what aa tough guy you are and how that is a replacement for thought, I might care what you think.

[T. Hanson]

"Mr. Monnig has produced a tour de force of the "They Did it Too!" variety. It didn't work when he was a toddler, and it doesn't work now when he's (presumably) an adult."

Just like:

Clinton did it too.

[BuddyT]

Once again lower case jack you have let allligator mouth overload your hummmingbird b-hole.

The issue is respect for the troops, one side has it and one does not. If you are so blinded by your hatred for all things politic it is no wonder to me that you cannot see the obvious....

BTW you voting Libertarian, or just writing in your own name?...lmao.....

[jack]

As long as we are busy playing the game of "who owes who an apology" the Nation is ignoring a couple little things. Like the war in Iraq, the healthcare problems, the SSI system being bankrupt, immigration, etc.

This is just exactly what the politicians want. They want to reduce the entire election in to "he said, she said". Why? So they can "activate the base".

The "base" loves to be iinsulted by whatever the other side says. They love to sit in judgement on who owes who an apology for hurting their poor little feelings. That way they don't have to challenge their own candidatees to do anything like, say, talk issues.

It also allows "the base" to ignore things about their own candidates they dislike. For instance, Rudi Guiliani is running TV ads about how insulted he is by the moveon ads and how every Dem now owes the world an apology. (An apology for something most had nothing to do with or any control over). This allows "the base" to get behind Rudi while ignorring his various marriages, various postions on gun control, his past support of abortion rights, etc.

If "the base" is stuck with who and what Rudi is, he ain't so pretty. But if all they have to look at is his supposed rage over who has proven what by not apologizing for that which they had nothing to do with, then they can get behind him.

BTW: Rudi is just an easy example. There are examples of the exact same game on both sides. But, go ahead and attack me for not defending the "I'm insulted politics" the "base" is so in love with.

If the "base" quits responding like Pavlov's dog to every "insult" one of theirs proclaims, there might be a discussion of issues during this election. Gee, wouldn't that be special.

But, then again, maybe there is a reason the politicians call this group "base".

[Gary]

The swift boaters certainly have nothing to apologize for, since the points they made about Kerry's swift boat service record were right. It was Kerry who set himself up for the fall by making building a military record out of lies and then setting it up as a centerpiece of his campaign.

[JUNGLEJACK]

Buddy T - Thanks for more excellent examples of those who "support the troops".

[BuddyT]

Hey Ron has Kerry apologized for his winter soldier testimony, ever? Did he apologize fot saying that Iragi troops should take over the duties of "terrorizing women and children in Irag?

Did Senator "Turban" Durbin apologize for saying our soldiers were no better than Nazi's, or murderers serving under Pol Pot?

Did "Chuckie" Schuler apologize for saying our guys couldn't handle the terrorists so we made the Sheiks take over?

Did John-Mother-of-all-morons apologize to trying, and convicting two innocent Marines in the Lame Stream Media?

I do not think you want to open this can of worms Ron baby....I really don't.

[JUNGLEJACK]

"Excellent points, Ron"

No. They're illogical points, for the following reasons:

"We have seen John Kerry “Swift Boated,”"

The Swift Boat Vets spent their own money as private citizens to put out a message that they deemed important - so who should apologize for that?

"John McCain’s patriotism and honor questioned, and Max Cleland referred to as unpatriotic."

... by whom? Disagreeing with one's positions, and declaring their ideas are harmful to our fight against terrorist aggression is not the same thing as questioning their honor.

"Has Limbaugh apologized?"

Are you freaking kidding me? How about "Has Dan Rather apologized?" Limbaugh makes no pretense that his show is pure opinion and entertainment - while Rather poses as a newsman and makes up stories for the sole purpose of influencing a presidential election.

"Is the White House... going to apologize for the lies perpetrated on the American people?"

Would it have been a lie if I had said before the season started that there was no way the Chargers could get off to an 1-2 start?

Being wrong isn't the same as lying - and we're not even sure WHAT the real story concerning the WMDs is. We know Saddam had them, and there's no evidence that he destroyed them, but it might still be years from now when we uncover the truth.

Clinton, in particular is looking bad in the whole "Betray-us" fiasco. There's no denying the connection between the Clintons and moveon - and besides that, we have her self-righteous remarks made against the general and his report before it was even presented - talk about "supporting the troops"!

[Chris40]

Mr. Monnig has produced a tour de force of the "They Did it Too!" variety. It didn't work when he was a toddler, and it doesn't work now when he's (presumably) an adult.

Just make sure to wash off the pacifier before you put it back in your mouth, Ron.

[Joe Barone]

Excellent points, Ron. We live in a nation of nasty, polarized politics which makes it possible for candidates to win offices but not to govern.