Barking back at the media

The “unbiased” media is now on a canine kick, giving adulation to Barack Obama’s puppy choice, as it continues to “dog” Sarah Palin.

Come on.

Beth Crane
Shawnee

Comments

[Jim]

Eng,

If it's true that the only Obama supporters you talk to are on this blog, then I'd hope you'd see a difference between the people on that video who don't know who Pelosi is, and people like me. That fact alone would seem to disprove your contention that the video is representative of the average Obama voter. It would also seem to call into question the basic premise of "How Obama Won," wouldn't it?

[Engineer]

Jim
Actually the only Obama supporters with whom I have discussions are on this blog. The others with whom I am very familiar are my youngest grandson (25) and a very intelligent daughter-in-law, his mother. It's an emotional subject with them so it doesn't get discussed. I remember how I felt about JFK. Let us hope that they are not in for the same disillusionment. But as I say, if a similar video is made on McCain supporters we will have a fair comparison.

[Jim]

Eng,

I'm talking about the questions used in the polling that you say backs up the "cut and paste" video of Obama supporters. I don't put much stock in "man on the street" videos as a whole, whether they show Republicans or Democrats. They can be edited to show the worst, as evidenced by the video you're boosting and the ones I posted here last night. They are one in the same, even if they use different tactics.

The thing is, you have a cartoon version of Obama supporters in your head, because it doesn't make sense that anyone who has any knowledge of the issues would vote for him, in your opinion. That's fine, but it seems to make you less discriminating when it comes to simple propoganda that backs up your opinion.

[Engineer]

Pub 17
So you admit that there is nothing you can say as to the splendid dialog from the left. the election is indeed over and now Obama will have to do rather than talk. I see no way he can do even a small part of what he has promised except to raise taxes. You are the economic authority, give me some examples of an economic downturn or recession being overcome by raising taxes.

[Engineer]

Jim
Your link was a "cut and paste" video which was filmed with the intent of showing McCain supporters in a bad light. Wasn't it apparent to you, just from the tome of voice of the questioner, that he was trying to provoke? In any event, if the clip did show animosity toward Obama it did no show ignorance of National affairs as did the video on Obama supporters. If the maker does a similar one on McCain supporters as proposed then we will have a valid basis of comparison. But how do you conduct a push poll by asking such questions as "Who is Barney Franks?", "Who is Harry Reid?" or "Who is Nancy Pelosi?"

[Pub 17]

Once again, like talking to my own shoes.

Engineer, the election's over, it won't be reversed, and those of us still engaged in the political process are going to be busy cleaning up the mess Bush made for at least two or three years. Stand over there out of the way, please, unless you want to pick up a hammer and help. If you don't, I believe there's a guy from Independence by the water fountain who wants to tell you how Roosevelt caused the Great Depression and how Bush saved us from the Clinton Recession with his tax cuts. Choose well.

[Jim]

Jeanette,

It's a little odd to me that you defend Palin by saying "sorry she wasn't smart enough for you." I personally think she's a very smart and crafty politician. I don't think she was ready for the job, and I don't think her record shows her as someone who is remotely interested in governing effectively or solving real problems.

Palin seemed more interested in getting off zingers and talking points in her interviews and speeches than in telling the country what she wanted to do, or even what she believes. Sorry, but calling Obama a terrorist is not an agenda. Simply saying you're a "maverick" and a "reformer" when you've got no record for being either is not enough.

I have no doubt that Palin has her eyes on the 2012 prize. This 4-year interim period gives her a golden opportunity to be an effective governor who solves some of Alaska's problems. Here's one I'm keenly interested in. The Anchorage Daily News has this story about the dismal state of Alaska's education system. It's a mess and a disgrace:

http://www.adn.com/education/story/590870.html

Now, Palin hasn't been the governor for that long, so this isn't all her fault, but there's no indication she's very interested or even aware of the problem. This is one of those key issues Republicans say they're so good at solving, and one that a true reformer should do great things with. I'll be watching Palin over the next four years to see if she does anything to solve this. My guess is she'll be too busy preening for her next shot at the big prize to worry about doing her actual job.

[Engineer]

Pub 17
Defy away. As soon as you answer my question I'll take up your "defy" bait. "So present your examples of the dialog on the left that were "thoughtful, objective, and supportive of well-argued opposing opinion""?

[Jim]

Eng,

Zeigler's poll was a push poll, plain and simple. It asked leading questions and got the responses he was looking for.

Asking "why do you support McCain?" isn't a dishonest question designed to elicit any particular response. If you honestly think that, I'd love to hear your argument. To me, it seems pretty silly. These people embarrassed themselves for no other reason than they actually believed what they were saying.

[Pub 17]

I'm not sure that I could identify any remarks from Obama supporters that extreme; in any case I'd need to convince myself that they were in some sense indicative of the general mindset of the Obama campaign, or sufficiently numerous or influential as to change its course from within. There's three hundred million people out there, the one guy who calls a black cameraman during a Palin appearance a Norwegian is of course going to be shamefully overreported, and I found plenty of other reasons to be appalled by Palin.

[EL]

Pub.
Maybe you misunderstood. I decided early not to vote for McCain AND I AM FAR FROM THE RIGHT WING.
I said extremist remarks from Obama supporters kept me from voting for Obama. I would have voted for Clinton or Biden.

[Pub 17]

I defy you to come up with any elected Democrat who took the winning-is-everything approach championed by Gingrich. I defy you to come up with any Democrat who took the Rovian approach of destroy the enemy during the last two Democratic administrations. I defy you to come up with any left-leaning Democratic talk-show host as vicious, unprincipled, and demagogic as Limbaugh, Savage, Hannity, O'Reilly, or the rest of that crew of draft-dodging cowards.

[Engineer]

Pub 17
And could you give some examples of the dialog on the left that were "thoughtful, objective, and supportive of well-argued opposing opinion"? Something from Al or Keith maybe? Or even from Nancy or Harry?

[Engineer]

stone
Jim's link was a video clip of an obvious attempt to elicit the responses the interviewers wanted. It was obviously a cut and paste job. On the other hand the video showing the ignorance of Obama supporters was based on provocative questions and showed a stunning lack of knowledge about the national political scene. It was based on a Zogby poll that indicated the same deficiencies of knowledge among Obama supporters. The maker of the video has agreed to use the same technique to make a video on McCain supporters. When this is done we will see how the two groups compare when presented on the same basis.

[Pub 17]

EL and jeanette
Any intimation by either of you that the dialogue on the right since the onset of deLay, Gingrich, and Lott, much less Limbaugh, Savage, Hannity, et al., has been thoughtful, objective, and supportive of well-argued opposing opinion is ludicrous, and you know it.

jeanette, my point is perfectly valid and, if anything, worth expanding upon. You want to explain what magic qualities Sarah Palin has that trump her pathetic education and extremely questionable performances as mayor of a tiny village and Wichita, Kansas--pardon me, the great state of Alaska, other than her ability to repeat "Second Amendment! No abortion!" to stir up the Energized Base, go ahead, but it's a little late in the game, don't you think? And when you've got it figured out, cc: George Will.

[EL]

stone;
I decided not to vote for McCain before he picked Palin as VP.
I considered voting for Obama but after reading remarks by his supporters, in papers and on the internet, calling any who question Obama panderers and nutcases and worse, I decided not to vote for anyone whose supporters were so extreme.

[jeanette]

I'm so sorry, stone, that you are so repulsed by me and my opinion.
And Pub, don't be ridiculous. You know exactly what I meant when I said that having a college degree doesn't necessarily make you intelligent.
And also thank you so much for making this such a welcoming board for people to voice their opinions. No wonder I've seen people post here once and never see them again.
Ah, liberals, the party of tolerance.

[stone]

if you look at any of the links Jim posted showing Palin supporters yesterday, you will notice that they are the reason why conservatives will NOT be back in force in 2012. Most of the country, as shown in the results of this last election, do NOT agree with these nutcases (people in the links jim posted) and do not want people they support running the country anymore.

the fact that conservatives pander to them rather than moderate republicans will keep the democrats in office for a long, long time. Sarah Palin's fans are mainly these people that repulse everyone else in the country

[Pub 17]

Sarah Palin's a liberal's dream: she's a candidate capable of siphoning off huge investments of time and money from that famous Energized Base and absolutely incapable of drawing support from liberals, moderates, and intellectual conservatives. Hey, she won it for Obama.

Oh-next time you go to the doctor, look for one without a college degree. They're SO much more sincere than those sheepskin phonies.

[jeanette]

You know, Jim, Palin might not have been the best candidate, but she is not and has never been the complete dolt all of you would love her to be. I hope she comes back with a vengeance in 2012 because I think you're wrong. She's the closest thing we've had to a true conservative candidate for a long time.
Sorry, Pub, not all of us agree that a college degree is as impressive as you do. Franken should have given up his degree and worked on his social skills.

[Pub 17]

It DID scare true conservatives to death, to the extent of criticizing her in the middle of presidential campaign. When was the last time you saw THAT?

[Jim]

"And you people call Sarah Palin a joke?"

Jeanette,

I don't think she's a joke, I think she's unqualified to be VP and unserious about it. She was also incredibly dishonest, inflating her credentials in bite-size applause lines even after they'd been exposed as completely untrue. The fact that many in the Republican Party seem to think she's the white knight that will bring them back should scare true conservatives to death.

[Pub 17]

Al Franken wasn't running for national office. Al Franken graduated cum laude from Harvard. Al Franken's written six books, five of them NYT bestsellers; like Jesse Ventura, who had a popular radio show, voters had years of exposure to him to know exactly what they were getting into. Now, you were talking about, who, Sarah Palin?

[whispering_to_kc]

**Woof, woof**

"You betcha."

**Wink, wink**

[jeanette]

It is a shame all the Republican candidates couldn't be as well qualified as say - Al Franken! And you people call Sarah Palin a joke?